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Nimue (Nimue)
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Username: Nimue

Post Number: 3623
Registered: 8-2001
Posted on Tuesday, August 19, 2008 - 2:44 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

When Lizina told me why she broke up with her boyfriend, I was surprised that anyone would end a romance for that reason. But I later read in a magazine article that this reason is fairly common. What is it??
Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
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Post Number: 266
Registered: 5-2003
Posted on Tuesday, August 19, 2008 - 6:36 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Does it have to do with:

An incompatibility of some sort?
A difference between Lizina and her boyfriend?
If so, a physical difference?
A difference in any of the following?
Skin color?
Ethnicity?
Nationality?
Politics?
Religion?
Location/distance/travel?
Allergies?
Relatives?

Was a specific incident responsible for the breakup? A string of incidents? A pattern of some sort?

Is the cause tangible?

Are external forces responsible? Or involved? Other people? Are location, nationality, or culture relevant?

Was the breakup mutual? If not, who initiated it, and is this relevant?

Was there anger on either side? Insecurity? Sorrow? A sense of inevitability?

If you feel the cause should not necessarily cause a breakup if it happened to you, would you assume it to at least cause friction? Hurt feelings?

Is this reason common to couples from all walks of life, or a specific sort of couple? For example, would it cause 20-somethings to break up, but not senior citizens? Urban couples, but not rural? American, but not British?

Does it break up marriages, or just boyfriend/girlfriend relationships?

Might any sort of couple break up for this reason? How about a gay couple?
Dlcygnet (Dlcygnet)
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Username: Dlcygnet

Post Number: 1367
Registered: 6-2005
Posted on Tuesday, August 19, 2008 - 5:08 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Lizina - HAF?
Boyfriend - HAM?

Were the two of them living together before the breakup?

Does the reason relate to... chores? driving directions/fighting in the car? bad conflict resolution skills?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Username: Nimue

Post Number: 3624
Registered: 8-2001
Posted on Tuesday, August 19, 2008 - 6:21 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
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Username: Jenburdoo

Post Number: 266
Registered: 5-2003

Posted on Tuesday, August 19, 2008 - 6:36 am: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Does it have to do with:

An incompatibility of some sort? yes
A difference between Lizina and her boyfriend? yes
If so, a physical difference?noish
A difference in any of the following?
Skin color? no
Ethnicity? no
Nationality? no
Politics? no or maybe noish
Religion? no
Location/distance/travel? no
Allergies? no
Relatives? no

Was a specific incident responsible for the breakup? yesish A string of incidents? no A pattern of some sort? no

Is the cause tangible? yes

Are external forces responsible?noish Or involved? ditto Other people? Are location, nationality, or culture relevant? no

Was the breakup mutual? noIf not, who initiated it Lizina, and is this relevant yes?

Was there anger on either side? possibly Insecurity?yesish Sorrow? noA sense of inevitability? yope

If you feel the cause should not necessarily cause a breakup if it happened to you, would you assume it to at least cause friction? possibly Hurt feelings? no

Is this reason common to couples from all walks of life, or a specific sort of couple? Some walks of life are more likely For example, would it cause 20-somethings to break up, but not senior citizens? No. I assume you mean old people the euthemism 'senior citizens'Urban couples, but not rural? Urbamn might be more likely American, but not British? I'm not sure about Briotish

Does it break up marriages, or just boyfriend/girlfriend relationships?

Might any sort of couple break up for this reason? yesish or yopeHow about a gay couple? yes
Dlcygnet (Dlcygnet)
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Username: Dlcygnet

Post Number: 1367
Registered: 6-2005

Posted on Tuesday, August 19, 2008 - 5:08 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Lizina - HAF?
Boyfriend - HAM?b{yes}

Were the two of them living together before the breakup? possibly

Does the reason relate to... chores? no driving directions/fighting in the car? no bad conflict resolution skills? yope
Nimue (Nimue)
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Username: Nimue

Post Number: 3625
Registered: 8-2001
Posted on Tuesday, August 19, 2008 - 6:26 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Does it break up marriages it could, or just boyfriend/girlfriend relationships no?
Dlcygnet (Dlcygnet)
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Username: Dlcygnet

Post Number: 1368
Registered: 6-2005
Posted on Tuesday, August 19, 2008 - 9:19 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

In Lizina's mind, is there something wrong with her boyfriend... physically? Mentally? emotionally? monitarily? status wise? equipment wise (does he own/not own something he should/shouldn't)? Morally? Personal preference wise? Addiction related (video games, tv, etc counts)?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Username: Nimue

Post Number: 3628
Registered: 8-2001
Posted on Tuesday, August 19, 2008 - 10:36 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Dlcygnet (Dlcygnet)
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Username: Dlcygnet

Post Number: 1368
Registered: 6-2005

Posted on Tuesday, August 19, 2008 - 9:19 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
In Lizina's mind, is there something wrong with her boyfriend... physically?no Mentally? yesemotionally? yes monitarily? no status wise? noequipment wise yes (does he ownyes/not own no something he should/shouldn't)? Morally? yes Personal preference wise? yes Addiction related (video games, tv, etc counts)? no. What doesn't count as an addiction noweadays??!!
Enjay (Enjay)
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Username: Enjay

Post Number: 1239
Registered: 4-2007
Posted on Tuesday, August 19, 2008 - 11:22 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Were you surprised that it was so common becuase you thought the situation would arise only rarely? Or because you thought it might arise, but not be a good reason to break up a relationship?

The thing the boyfriend owned: did he buy it? Relevant? Did owning this thing tell Lizina something about his personality? That he was unlikely to be good boyfriend material? That he was not the person she thought he was?

Could anyone own this thing? Is it the owning itself that caused Lizina to break up with him, or is there more to it? If her next boyfriend had also owned one, would she have broken up with him?
If a girl owned one, could a boy reasonably (or as reasonably as Lizina's decision, anyway) break up with her?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Username: Nimue

Post Number: 3629
Registered: 8-2001
Posted on Tuesday, August 19, 2008 - 11:44 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Enjay (Enjay)
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Username: Enjay

Post Number: 1239
Registered: 4-2007

Posted on Tuesday, August 19, 2008 - 11:22 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Were you surprised that it was so common becuase you thought the situation would arise only rarely? no Or because you thought it might arise, but not be a good reason to break up a relationship?Lots of bad reasons for breakups--weight gain, race of ethnicity, illness--wouldn't surprise me, because I already know how superficial many people are & can understand their vlaues, even though I don't agree with them. This reason strikes me not just as bad, but as hard to understand.

The thing the boyfriend owned: did he buy it?probably Relevant? somewhat Did owning this thing tell Lizina something about his personality? yes That he was unlikely to be good boyfriend material? Well, that's what she thought That he was not the person she thought he was? yes

Could anyone own this thing? yesish Is it the owning itself that caused Lizina to break up with him yes, or is there more to it no? If her next boyfriend had also owned one, would she have broken up with him? yes
If a girl owned one, could a boy reasonably (or as reasonably as Lizina's decision, anyway) break up with her? yes
Jumpingjack (Jumpingjack)
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Username: Jumpingjack

Post Number: 995
Registered: 3-2006
Posted on Wednesday, August 20, 2008 - 8:22 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did he own a large porn collection? Regarding the noish you gave to political incompatibility--perhaps she saw this as demeaning towards women?
Martinfg (Martinfg)
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Username: Martinfg

Post Number: 550
Registered: 8-2005
Posted on Wednesday, August 20, 2008 - 9:12 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is it a gun?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Username: Nimue

Post Number: 3631
Registered: 8-2001
Posted on Wednesday, August 20, 2008 - 7:02 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

(Jumpingjack)
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Username: Jumpingjack

Post Number: 995
Registered: 3-2006
Posted on Wednesday, August 20, 2008 - 8:22 am:
Did he own a large porn collection?noRegarding the noish you gave to political incompatibility--perhaps she saw this as demeaning towards women? No--again, while I consider this a silly reason to end a romance, I understand the thinking behind it.
Martinfg (Martinfg)
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Username: Martinfg

Post Number: 550
Registered: 8-2005
Posted on Wednesday, August 20, 2008 - 9:12 am:
Is it a gun? yes



*******SPOILER *************
Lizina broke up with Ted when she discovered (possibly because he told her) that he owned a gun. She's not a pacifist who's in principle opposed to self-defense. That reason I can understand, even though I don't share it. She just felt unsafe around a man who owned a gun. That seems weird. If she thinks there's any chance he'd be violent toward her, why was she involved with him in the first place? After all, he also, like everyone, owns knives. I support gun control because I do think owning a gun increases the chance, for many owners, that they will commit murder. But I can't imagine being romantically involved with a man who thought had any chance of murdering me. This (apparently ridiculously easy) puzzle is a good illustration of how I'm a bad judge of which puzzles will be easy. But I hope my new one at the bottom of the page won't be. Check it out!!
Martinfg (Martinfg)
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Username: Martinfg

Post Number: 560
Registered: 8-2005
Posted on Thursday, August 21, 2008 - 12:14 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Yeah wierd ethical can of worms here, its like saying because you own a car you might run me over!!!!
Nimue (Nimue)
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Username: Nimue

Post Number: 3635
Registered: 8-2001
Posted on Thursday, August 21, 2008 - 12:23 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Precisely!!
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Username: Liquizt

Post Number: 277
Registered: 5-2008
Posted on Thursday, August 21, 2008 - 5:17 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I think it's more if ever there were a strong argument between them and emotions flared high, (if there was any risk of him becoming emotionally unstable in such a situation) it would be easily within his means to cause a considerable amount of damage to her, possibly even death, regardless of whether or not that were his intention.

I think the difference between a gun and a car in this situation is that the gun's primary function is to cause injury (or [arguably] to a lesser extent fear) wheras the car, whilst able to be used as a weapon, has a harmless primary function and as such is unlikely(/less likely) to be immediately considered as a means to frighten, injure or kill during a period of flared emotion (unless you happen to be sitting behind the wheel of it at the time).
Nimue (Nimue)
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Username: Nimue

Post Number: 3643
Registered: 8-2001
Posted on Thursday, August 21, 2008 - 5:42 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

But why get romantically involved with anyone you think might be "unstable" enough to shoot you in the heat of argument?
Dlcygnet (Dlcygnet)
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Username: Dlcygnet

Post Number: 1370
Registered: 6-2005
Posted on Thursday, August 21, 2008 - 9:30 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I agree with Nimue's reasoning. If a person is unstable enough to want to kill you, they'll find a way to do it. No gun needed.

I'm in the military. I know how to shoot and I'm comfortable with their purpose in life; but would not want a gun in my house. I've dated plenty of people who shoot for fun or own guns and (last month) married a boy scout with several shooting awards. We do not have a gun in our home though. I believe his grandfather keeps a riffle at his farm with my husband's name on it though.

Why the need to distance myself from the weapons:
1, People with guns are more likely to try to use them because they feel powerful. If a burglar breaks in, my husband would probably try to defend us rather than shout we've called the police and let the burglar make his own way out. If threatened, or boxed in, the burglar will always fight/shoot his way out. End result: If he's the better shot - you're outta luck.
2, People who have been trained to use weapons generally have few to no weapon related accidents. But what happens if the future kids (Who, for argument sake, wouldn't be trained on weapons until they are scout age), their friends, relatives, etc. happen upon the gun and don't know how to use it or do something stupid with the safety off? And actually, a safety is no guarantee for keeping the weapon from going off (only takes about 15 pounds of pressure to break past most of them; i.e. drop the weapon or deliberately pull the trigger).
3, It's just one more thing you have to take EXTRA procautions to secure, insure, and get licensed on.
4, Training - If you truly want to be proficient and safe on a weapon, you need to go to the range at least once a month. How many average working-class gun owners actually take the time to do that? I'm working overtime with Boeing and an Army Reservist, I don't have time. My husband works fulltime as a System Administrator and goes to school part time; he doesn't have time. Who really does? Generally people who use weapons as part of their regular jobs and can take time during the work day (Police, Security guards, Active Duty Army, Unemployed people, etc.)

So, I doubt the girl feared for her life when she found out that this person owned a gun. But since he already owns the gun (expensive) and keeps it at his place or on his person (if it's on him at all times though, I'd be inclined to wonder if he's in a gang), it would be nearly impossible to get him to give it up in the future; even if it's something that makes her uncomfortable and they had a real future together. I.e. Realistic women don't go into a relationship expecting the man in their life to change. (Though they will sure try.)
Nimue (Nimue)
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Username: Nimue

Post Number: 3646
Registered: 8-2001
Posted on Saturday, August 23, 2008 - 8:27 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I support gun control because I think there's a risk that many people will use a gun to commit murder. But, as I said, I sure wouldn't get involved with a man who I thought would do that. As for women who expect a man to change, I think it's pretty unsavory to regard a lover or spouse as a what realtors call a fixer-upper, that is, something that would be fine if improvements were made. But I haven't noticed that women are more likely to have this attitude than men. By the way, in the cases I've read & heard about, the man kept the gun at home, not on his person at all times. I agree with D. about the risk if a couple has children, I'm so non-maternal that I wasn't thinking in those terms at all.And the cases I read about involved boyfriends rather than husbands.

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