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Gregoryuconn (Gregoryuconn)
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Post Number: 396
Registered: 9-2010
Posted on Saturday, November 27, 2010 - 7:58 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Alex, Bob, Carl, and Dan go to a restaurant for dinner and order albatross. After the waiter brings the food, Alex shoots Bob twice, Carl three times, and Dan once. Bob then shoots Alex. A few minutes later, Alex runs home and commits suicide. About a year later, four men bring the waiter to a private room, tie him up, and shoot him repeatedly. How can this most bizarre situation be explained?

Note: The similar "classic" puzzle is related to this, but there is far more going on here.
Kayleetonkslupin (Kayleetonkslupin)
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Post Number: 1745
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Posted on Saturday, November 27, 2010 - 8:47 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Are Alex, Bob, Carl, and Dan all H/A/M?
Do they know each other?
Were they shot with a gun? A camera?
Were they ever on a deserted island?
Assuming yes, was it the same island? Were they together?
Did Alex commit suicide with a gun? The same gun used in the shooting, if a camera was not used? With some other weapon?
Are the four men related in any way to Alex, Bob, Carl, and Dan, if they are not in fact Alex, Bob, Carl and Dan?
Markobr (Markobr)
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Post Number: 921
Registered: 5-2009
Posted on Saturday, November 27, 2010 - 9:19 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Alex shoots Bob: with a weapon? a camera?
Alex shoots Carl: with a weapon? a camera?
Alex shoots Dan: with a weapon? a camera?
Bob shoots Alex: with a weapon? a camera?
Four men shoot the waiter: with a weapon? a camera?

Alex runs home: Is it relevant that he doesn't walk? Drive? Does he run to his own home?

Alex commits suicide: Successfully? Did he intend to do so when he started running home? When he arrived there?

Did Alex eat some of the food? Bob? Carl? Dan? The waiter?
Kayleetonkslupin (Kayleetonkslupin)
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Username: Kayleetonkslupin

Post Number: 1747
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Posted on Saturday, November 27, 2010 - 11:57 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

TortieKitten can't come to the computer right now, because I'm on it and she doesn't have her laptop here. But she wants to know, providing that three of the four people who come to the restaurant and kill the waiter are Bob, Carl, and Dan, who is the fourth person (since Alex is apparently dead at his own hand)?
Gregoryuconn (Gregoryuconn)
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Username: Gregoryuconn

Post Number: 397
Registered: 9-2010
Posted on Sunday, November 28, 2010 - 4:11 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Are Alex, Bob, Carl, and Dan all H/A/M? Yes
Do they know each other? Yes
Were they shot with a gun? A camera? This one. Good job getting it so quick.
Were they ever on a deserted island?
Assuming yes, was it the same island? Were they together? Yes to these
Did Alex commit suicide with a gun? irrelevant The same gun used in the shooting, if a camera was not used? With some other weapon?
Are the four men related in any way to Alex, Bob, Carl, and Dan, if they are not in fact Alex, Bob, Carl and Dan? The four men are not Alex, Bob, Carl, and Dan. If they are related, probably not but DOYD of "related".

Alex shoots Bob: with a weapon? a camera?
Alex shoots Carl: with a weapon? a camera?
Alex shoots Dan: with a weapon? a camera?
Bob shoots Alex: with a weapon? a camera? As mentioned above, it was a camera.
Four men shoot the waiter: with a weapon? a camera? Weapon

Alex runs home: Is it relevant that he doesn't walk? Drive? Does he run to his own home? He runs home. The act of running isn't relevant. Assume it's his own home.

Alex commits suicide: Successfully? Did he intend to do so when he started running home? When he arrived there? Yes to all

Did Alex eat some of the food? Yes Bob? Carl? Dan? One of them definitely ate it - let's assume it's Bob. Carl and Dan probably did too. The waiter? Doubtful.

TortieKitten can't come to the computer right now, because I'm on it and she doesn't have her laptop here. But she wants to know, providing that three of the four people who come to the restaurant and kill the waiter are Bob, Carl, and Dan, who is the fourth person (since Alex is apparently dead at his own hand)? Bob, Carl, and Dan were not the ones who killed the waiter. And the waiter wasn't at the restaurant at the time.
Balin (Balin)
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Username: Balin

Post Number: 8847
Registered: 4-2010
Posted on Sunday, November 28, 2010 - 9:12 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was the albatross actually albatross?

Had any of A/B/C/D tried albatross before? If so, was it actually albatross?
Gregoryuconn (Gregoryuconn)
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Post Number: 398
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Posted on Monday, November 29, 2010 - 2:21 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was the albatross actually albatross? No! Good question

Had any of A/B/C/D tried albatross before? If so, was it actually albatross? They all have, and it was.
Balin (Balin)
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Post Number: 8859
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Posted on Monday, November 29, 2010 - 12:58 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did A/B/C/D think they were eating albatross? Think they were eating something else?

The first time they tried it - is that related to the classic? Were they on a deserted island?
Markobr (Markobr)
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Post Number: 930
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Posted on Monday, November 29, 2010 - 6:11 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Are B, C, and D alive when the waiter is killed?

Did A commit suicide because he assumed he didn't consume albatross the first time? Because he assumed (some of) the others would assume this?

When they tried albatross the first time: Were they together when they did? Did some of them shoot/catch the albatross then (if so: A? B? C? D?)? Did anyone of them doubt he really ate albatross before getting the non-albatross at the restaurant (if so: A? B? C? D?)
Gregoryuconn (Gregoryuconn)
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Post Number: 401
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Posted on Monday, November 29, 2010 - 9:20 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did A/B/C/D think they were eating albatross? Think they were eating something else? When?

The first time they tried it - is that related to the classic? Were they on a deserted island? Yes. It's similar to the classic, only it really was albatross, not dead human.

Are B, C, and D alive when the waiter is killed? Assume yes.

Did A commit suicide because he assumed he didn't consume albatross the first time? Yes. Exactly as in the classic except he was wrong. Because he assumed (some of) the others would assume this? Possibly

When they tried albatross the first time: Were they together when they did? Well they were all on the island... Did some of them shoot/catch the albatross then (if so: A? B? C? D?)? Someone must have. It doesn't matter who. Did anyone of them doubt he really ate albatross before getting the non-albatross at the restaurant (if so: A? B? C? D?) No.
Markobr (Markobr)
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Post Number: 936
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Posted on Monday, November 29, 2010 - 9:48 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is the following correct: A, B, C and D were on a deserted island and had to find something to eat. One (or more) of them managed to kill an albatross which they all ate.

Were any other persons on the deserted island at the same time? One? Two? More? If so: Was anyone of them killed while A..D were on the island?

Did the waiter serve non-albatross in order to do harm to anybody (if so: A? B? C? D someone else?)? Or just because he didn't have any real albatross to serve?

Is the killing of the waiter an execution? Murder?
Gregoryuconn (Gregoryuconn)
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Post Number: 403
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Posted on Monday, November 29, 2010 - 11:59 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is the following correct: A, B, C and D were on a deserted island and had to find something to eat. One (or more) of them managed to kill an albatross which they all ate. Yes, but keep in mind this was before the restaurant scene.

Were any other persons on the deserted island at the same time? One? Two? More? If so: Was anyone of them killed while A..D were on the island? If so, they are irrelevant. Assume there were none.

Did the waiter serve non-albatross in order to do harm to anybody (if so: A? B? C? D someone else?)? Or just because he didn't have any real albatross to serve? Assume it was malevolent.

Is the killing of the waiter an execution? This one. Murder? If you believe the death penalty is murder, then yes, I suppose it would be. But legally, no.
Balin (Balin)
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Username: Balin

Post Number: 8867
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Posted on Tuesday, November 30, 2010 - 12:21 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did they assume the waiter was a murderer? Did they think he had killed a person? Was he a murderer?

Ooh, ooh, idea...in the restaurant, were they actually eating human?
Gregoryuconn (Gregoryuconn)
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Post Number: 404
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Posted on Tuesday, November 30, 2010 - 1:06 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did they assume the waiter was a murderer? See below Did they think he had killed a person? See below Was he a murderer? Possibly manslaughter, possibly murder. I'm not a legal expert.

Ooh, ooh, idea...in the restaurant, were they actually eating human? No. Good thought though.
Balin (Balin)
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Username: Balin

Post Number: 8877
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Posted on Tuesday, November 30, 2010 - 1:13 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did they think the waiter had killed Alex?

Relevant what they were actually eating in the restaurant? Was it another type of bird?
Gregoryuconn (Gregoryuconn)
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Post Number: 407
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Posted on Tuesday, November 30, 2010 - 3:32 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did they think the waiter had killed Alex? Not directly, but he had plotted.

Relevant what they were actually eating in the restaurant? No Was it another type of bird? Probably
Balin (Balin)
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Post Number: 8886
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Posted on Tuesday, November 30, 2010 - 12:21 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did the waiter serve the fake albatross so that Alex would kill himself? By following the line of thinking from the classic?
Gregoryuconn (Gregoryuconn)
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Post Number: 410
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Posted on Tuesday, November 30, 2010 - 3:20 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did the waiter serve the fake albatross so that Alex would kill himself? By following the line of thinking from the classic? Yes. Now just find out why they shot eachother with camera and who the four men are.
Balin (Balin)
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Post Number: 8895
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Posted on Tuesday, November 30, 2010 - 4:21 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is any of A/B/C/D's occupations relevant? Any of the four men's?

Are any of A/B/C/D included in the four men? Any of their relatives?
Gregoryuconn (Gregoryuconn)
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Post Number: 411
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Posted on Tuesday, November 30, 2010 - 8:52 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is any of A/B/C/D's occupations relevant? No Any of the four men's? Yes. And to spare you the trouble, they're in law enforcement.

Are any of A/B/C/D included in the four men? No Any of their relatives? No
Docd (Docd)
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Posted on Wednesday, December 01, 2010 - 12:49 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

The 4 men. Were they a firing squad (performing a judicial execution)?
Gregoryuconn (Gregoryuconn)
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Post Number: 412
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Posted on Wednesday, December 01, 2010 - 3:38 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

The 4 men. Were they a firing squad (performing a judicial execution)? Precisely.
Balin (Balin)
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Post Number: 8919
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Posted on Wednesday, December 01, 2010 - 7:00 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Were A/B/C/D shot with the same camera? Were the pictures candid shots? Posed shots? Were they eating the "albatross" when the picture was taken?
Gregoryuconn (Gregoryuconn)
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Post Number: 414
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Posted on Thursday, December 02, 2010 - 3:20 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Were A/B/C/D shot with the same camera? Were the pictures candid shots? Posed shots? irrelevant to this Were they eating the "albatross" when the picture was taken? Assume it was just before they ate the albatross.
Balin (Balin)
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Post Number: 8945
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Posted on Thursday, December 02, 2010 - 4:18 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Were the pictures used as evidence to convict the waiter? Were the pictures relevant to Alex's suicide at all?
Gregoryuconn (Gregoryuconn)
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Posted on Thursday, December 02, 2010 - 5:32 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Were the pictures used as evidence to convict the waiter? Were the pictures relevant to Alex's suicide at all? Only in that the restaurant scene with the fake albatross is relevant. And the pictures themselves are not relevant. I only threw them in there so I could use the word "shoot".
Balin (Balin)
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Post Number: 8964
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Posted on Thursday, December 02, 2010 - 7:37 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did Alex commit suicide by the same reasoning as Classic Man?
Gregoryuconn (Gregoryuconn)
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Posted on Friday, December 03, 2010 - 1:01 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did Alex commit suicide by the same reasoning as Classic Man? Yes, although in this case his reasoning is faulty.
Balin (Balin)
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Post Number: 9008
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Posted on Friday, December 03, 2010 - 1:42 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

So Alex thought that he had actually eaten human on the island? Only it was really albatross? And the "fake albatross" made him think that...well, you know the rest? *unintentional reference to woubit's Christmas puzzle*

Had Alex been stranded on the deserted island with the waiter?
Gregoryuconn (Gregoryuconn)
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Post Number: 425
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Posted on Friday, December 03, 2010 - 2:41 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
So Alex thought that he had actually eaten human on the island? Only it was really albatross? And the "fake albatross" made him think that...well, you know the rest? *unintentional reference to woubit's Christmas puzzle* Yes! And that's good anough for a spoiler
******SPOILER************
A B C D had been on desserted Island years before and had eaten albatross that one had killed. Years later, they reunite and go to restauarant and decide they will all eat albatross to celebrate liberation. However, Waiter overhears and decides he wants to be mean and kill Alex so he secretly substitutes pelican. Alex eats the Pelican thinking it's albatross, and when ne notices it tastes different he assumes he ate dead human from his friend Edgar who also was on the island but died, and runs home and kills himself. Bob then recognizes it as Pelican and alerts the others, but it is too late for Alex. The waiter, meanwhile, is found guilty of murdering Alex, sentenced to death, and executed. Good job Balin! You've done it again.


Had Alex been stranded on the deserted island with the waiter?
Balin (Balin)
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Username: Balin

Post Number: 9018
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Posted on Friday, December 03, 2010 - 4:31 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Fun puzzle!

IMHO, spinoffs from classics are always awesome, and definitely provide an interesting way of thinking laterally about lateral thinking.

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