[IrishElk] No Place to Hide

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[IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby irishelk » Mon Aug 21, 2017 1:09 pm

Mike, who was not a doctor, suggested that it would be good for his friend Jim to stop taking his medication. Mike later regretted the suggestion, but not just because it made Jim ill.
Last edited by irishelk on Mon Aug 28, 2017 12:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby Earnest » Mon Aug 21, 2017 7:28 pm

So...all HAM? Was the medication for Jim? If not did mike know it?

Did the stop suggested by M, have negative consequences on J? On M? On others? Relevant the reason why M made the suggestion to J? Is it relevant which was the medication? A pill? Is it relevant the profession of J? The one of M?
Relevant if J had an illness? If so, relevant which one?

Did J follow M siuggestion? Or he continued to do the medication?
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby Balin » Mon Aug 21, 2017 9:35 pm

Did Jim become ill for taking his medication?
Had Jim taken the medication to treat an illness? If so, a physical illness? Mental illness?
Relevant Jim's profession? Mike's?
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby irishelk » Wed Aug 23, 2017 12:08 am

Earnest

So...all HAM? Yes. Was the medication for Jim? Yes. If not did mike know it?

Did the stop suggested by M, have negative consequences on J? Yes. On M? No. On others? Yes, indirectly. Relevant the reason why M made the suggestion to J? Yes. Is it relevant which was the medication? Yes. A pill? I believe so. The form of medicine (pill vs. liquid, etc.) isn't relevant, but something about it is. Is it relevant the profession of J? No, but might help you. The one of M? Ditto.
Relevant if J had an illness? Yes. If so, relevant which one? Yes.

Did J follow M suggestion? Yes. Or he continued to do the medication? Yope.


Balin

Did Jim become ill for taking his medication? Yes, possibly DOYD of "ill".
Had Jim taken the medication to treat an illness? Yes. If so, a physical illness? Yes. Mental illness? No. Relevant Jim's profession? Mike's? See above.
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby Earnest » Wed Aug 23, 2017 8:51 am

Was the one of J a common ill? (I mean the one for which he took the medication) A cold? A contagious disease?
symptoms = cough? temperature? sore throat?

So J stop the original medication, right? But was him forced/did he choose to follow an alternative form of medication? E.g. a natural one?
Did M suggested to J just to stop the medication? Or did he suggest also an alternative?

The form of medicine (pill vs. liquid, etc.) isn't relevant, but something about it is--> is it relevant how the medication should be taken? E.g. with water? Expiry date? Availability of the medication? Taste? Side effects? Dosage?

Did M and J work together? Did M suggested J to stop the medication because of the contraindications/side effects of the medication? Was J embarrassed for some discomfort caused by the medication? Was him unable/forced not to do something due to the medication?

Did M regret of his suggestion after having seen J again? Did he regret after a month? A week? Few days? Few seconds? Few hours? Minutes? Relevant the relationship between J and M? Were them friends? Brothers? Is blood somehow involved?
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby Westing1992 » Sat Aug 26, 2017 3:06 pm

Was the medicine prescription?
Operating heavy machinery relevant? Drowsiness? Insomnia?
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby irishelk » Mon Aug 28, 2017 12:51 pm

Earnest

Was the one of J a common ill? (I mean the one for which he took the medication) I'll say no--you've heard of it, but most people don't get it. A cold? A contagious disease?
symptoms = cough? temperature? sore throat? No to rest.

So J stop the original medication, right? Yesish. But was him forced/did he choose to follow an alternative form of medication? E.g. a natural one? No.
Did M suggested to J just to stop the medication? Yesish. Or did he suggest also an alternative? No.

The form of medicine (pill vs. liquid, etc.) isn't relevant, but something about it is--> is it relevant how the medication should be taken? E.g. with water? Expiry date? Availability of the medication? Taste? Side effects? Dosage? No to all.

Did M and J work together? Yes. Did M suggested J to stop the medication because of the contraindications/side effects of the medication? No. Was J embarrassed for some discomfort caused by the medication? No. Was him unable/forced not to do something due to the medication? No, maybe explore.

Did M regret of his suggestion after having seen J again? Yes, but irr. Did he regret after a month? A week? Few days? Few seconds? Few hours? Minutes? Probably months to years, but irr. Relevant the relationship between J and M? Not really. Were them friends? Yes. Brothers? No.
Is blood somehow involved? In a way.

Westing1992

Was the medicine prescription? Yes.
Operating heavy machinery relevant? Drowsiness? Insomnia? No to rest.
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby irishelk » Tue Sep 12, 2017 11:15 pm

HINT: Mike changed his mind about something major.
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby Earnest » Thu Sep 14, 2017 8:04 am

Was mike concerned about the fact that jim could infect someone else?

something major = something related to the illness? Is it relevant the regularity with which M took the medicine? Hadn't he take the pill, was there a risk that he was not covered for another medicine he needed? Was there the risk that M forget something important? Assume water? Assume something he needed which hw took together with the pill?
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby irishelk » Tue Sep 19, 2017 11:28 pm

Earnest

Was mike concerned about the fact that jim could infect someone else? No.

something major = something related to the illness? No. Is it relevant the regularity with which M took the medicine? No. Hadn't he take the pill, was there a risk that he was not covered for another medicine he needed? No.Was there the risk that M forget something important? Assume water? Assume something he needed which he took together with the pill? No to rest.
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby Earnest » Wed Sep 20, 2017 7:47 am

wow what a nice turn I had ahahahaha

was it required that J make some type of analysis in order to take/ to continue taking the medicine? (e.g. blood draw)

Did J appear weaker than before? Was something changed in their relationship when J began to take the pill? Was something changed in J's behavior? Was something changed at all? Did J need to use a wheelchair? Was J able to move or did he have difficulties? Did he have pains? If so which part of his body was the most affected: stomach? Eyes? Arms? Legs? Back? Feet? is it a physical disease in the sense that it involves mainly internal organs? Skin? Bones? (arthrosis?)

Had their job something to do with pharmaceutical industry? Hospitals? Medicine? (I mean M was not a doctor does not imply that he did not work in an hospital for instance right?)

Was J illness infectious?
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby irishelk » Mon Sep 25, 2017 6:58 pm

Earnest

wow what a nice turn I had ahahahaha It's important to rule things out too. :lol:

was it required that J make some type of analysis in order to take/ to continue taking the medicine? (e.g. blood draw) No.

Did J appear weaker than before? Noish. Was something changed in their relationship when J began to take the pill? No. Was something changed in J's behavior? No. Was something changed at all? At one point, yes.
Did J need to use a wheelchair? No. Was J able to move Yes. or did he have difficulties? Yes. Did he have pains? Probably but irr. If so which part of his body was the most affected: stomach? Eyes? Arms? Legs? Back? Feet? None of these areas relevantly. is it a physical disease Yes... in the sense that it involves mainly internal organs? Skin? Bones? See next answer... (arthrosis?) Yes! (Well, some kind of arthritis at least.)

Had their job something to do with pharmaceutical industry? No. Hospitals? Medicine? (I mean M was not a doctor does not imply that he did not work in an hospital for instance right?) True! But no to all. =)

Was J illness infectious? No.
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby Earnest » Tue Sep 26, 2017 8:21 am

so brief recap...M told J not to take his pill for arthrosis but then regret it, right?

Maybe already asked but to be sure...was M aware that J suffered from that specific disease? Or did he usually see J just taking pills? Did M see J taking pills just in a particular part of the day? Like at lunch? Is it relevant? Stop taking medication = stop taking pills for arthrosis at all? Or stop taking other medications? I mean...maybe M see J when he takes the pills for diabetes (example) and he told him to stop taking that pills and not the arthrosis ones...

Was the suggestion of M mainly led by: the use/abuse of pills made by J? The fact that J needed to take the pills in particular times during the day? The well being of J (I mean, what M thought was the well-being of J)? J's performances at work? Something related to the work? The fact that if J took the medicines he (J) was unable to do something? (e.g. something forbidden to people with such sort of diseases)
Are M and J retired? Or do they actually work together? Pink collars? White collars? Blue collars? Food related job? Health care related job? Army? Offices relevant?
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby irishelk » Sun Oct 01, 2017 7:51 pm

Earnest

so brief recap...M told J not to take his pill for arthrosis but then regret it, right? Right. Technically it's rheumatoid arthritis, not super-relevant.

Maybe already asked but to be sure...was M aware that J suffered from that specific disease? Yes. Or did he usually see J just taking pills? Did M see J taking pills just in a particular part of the day? Like at lunch? Is it relevant? Irr.
Stop taking medication = stop taking pills for arthrosis at all? Yope. Or stop taking other medications? No. I mean...maybe M see J when he takes the pills for diabetes (example) and he told him to stop taking that pills and not the arthrosis ones... Not this.

Was the suggestion of M mainly led by: the use/abuse of pills made by J? No. The fact that J needed to take the pills in particular times during the day? No. The well being of J (I mean, what M thought was the well-being of J)? In a sense. J's performances at work? No. Something related to the work? No. The fact that if J took the medicines he (J) was unable to do something? Noish, but explore. (e.g. something forbidden to people with such sort of diseases) Not this.
Are M and J retired? J is retired in a sense, but they do work together. Or do they actually work together? Pink collars? White collars? I'd say this, but kind of hard to classify. Their exact jobs might help but are not central to the solution. Blue collars? Food related job? Health care related job? Army? Offices relevant? No to rest.
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby Hobbsicle » Sun Oct 15, 2017 3:01 am

Does M suggest that J still get his prescription filled, but not take them? Perhaps sell them? Or do something else with them other than take them the standard way?
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby irishelk » Mon Oct 16, 2017 11:31 am

Hobbsicle

Does M suggest that J still get his prescription filled, but not take them? Possibly, prescription irr. Perhaps sell them? No. Or do something else with them other than take them the standard way? No.
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby Balin » Tue Oct 17, 2017 2:50 pm

The thing Mike changed his mind about - something related to his personal life? His occupation? Something related to Jim?
Is marriage relevant?
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby irishelk » Tue Oct 17, 2017 4:00 pm

Balin

The thing Mike changed his mind about - something related to his personal life? His occupation? Only indirectly. Something related to Jim? Yes.
Is marriage relevant? Very indirectly.
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby Hobbsicle » Fri Oct 20, 2017 3:12 am

Does Mike make the suggestion for Jim's best interests? For his own best interests? For the best interests of another? Were either of them in danger? Is anyone else relevant to the puzzle? Was his suggestion intended to be short-term? Indefinite? Permanent?
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby irishelk » Sat Oct 21, 2017 12:16 am

Hobbsicle

Does Mike make the suggestion for Jim's best interests? Yes. For his own best interests? Possibly, irr. For the best interests of another? No. Were either of them in danger? DOYD. Jim was, in a sense. Is anyone else relevant to the puzzle? Yes. Was his suggestion intended to be short-term? Yes, good question. Indefinite? Permanent? No to rest.
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby GalFisk » Fri Oct 27, 2017 6:59 am

Short-term: hours? Days? Weeks? Anyone else: one person? One group? Someone acting as a professional?
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby irishelk » Sun Oct 29, 2017 5:40 pm

GalFisk

Short-term: hours? Days? Probably this. Weeks?

Anyone else: one person? One group? Someone acting as a professional? Several people are involved, with varying degrees of directness to the puzzle: two individuals, one group, and several people acting in a professional capacity.
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby irishelk » Thu Nov 02, 2017 1:15 pm

************************************RECAP

Mike suggests that Jim stop taking the pills he is prescribed for his rheumatoid arthritis. Mike only wants him to do this for a few days. Mike isn't concerned about drug interactions, or anything that Jim eats, drinks or does when taking the pill; he doesn't think Jim is abusing drugs, but the suggestion is in Jim's best interests. He doesn't want Jim to do anything in particular with the pills he doesn't take.

Mike changed his mind years later, about something major in connection to Jim, and this made him regret his suggestion that Jim stop taking the pills.

There is a larger situation yet to be discovered in which many other people are either directly or tangentially involved. Mike and Jim's professions are not directly relevant, but might help you. Jim is in trouble.
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby Balin » Sat Nov 11, 2017 1:19 am

Is Jim in financial trouble? Legal trouble? Is Jim in prison?
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby irishelk » Sat Nov 11, 2017 1:43 pm

Balin

Is Jim in financial trouble? Probably, but irr. Legal trouble? Yes. Is Jim in prison? No.
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby GalFisk » Sun Nov 12, 2017 11:23 am

Drug tests relevant? Relevant how often the pills are taken? Does not taking them for a few days have any relevant medical effects? Does not taking them cause relevant suspicion? Did Jim get punished for a crime? Did Jim do the thing he's in trouble for?
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby irishelk » Sun Nov 12, 2017 4:33 pm

GalFisk

Drug tests relevant? No. Relevant how often the pills are taken? No. Does not taking them for a few days have any relevant medical effects? YES.
Does not taking them cause relevant suspicion? No. Did Jim get punished for a crime? No. Did Jim do the thing he's in trouble for? Hard to answer. I'll say yesish, explore.
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby Balin » Mon Nov 13, 2017 12:37 am

Does he suffer from withdrawal of some sort?
Are the effects of not taking the meds physical? Mental?
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby irishelk » Mon Nov 13, 2017 5:30 pm

Balin

Does he suffer from withdrawal of some sort? No.
Are the effects of not taking the meds physical? Yes. Mental? No.
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby biograd » Fri Nov 17, 2017 11:38 pm

Was the medication for arthritis a narcotic painkiller? a non-narcotic medication such as an anti-inflammatory? Relevant? If the same medication were taken for another painful condition (not rheumatoid arthritis), would the situation be the same? What if it were taken for a non-painful condition (provided taking the drug would make sense for that)?

Is the relevant effect of stopping the medication that the arthritis itself would get worse? or something unrelated to that?

You said that Jim was not abusing the medication, nor did Mike think he was, but is the abuse of narcotics more broadly relevant?

WAG: Jim's medication WAS a narcotic, and someone thought he was selling his pills, but if stopping them made his arthritis measurably worse, this would prove that he had been taking and not selling them.

Assuming it's NOT this, does the effect of stopping the medication, nevertheless, prove something?
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby dukhsan » Sat Nov 18, 2017 3:42 am

With drug tests as a no, does this confirm a clinical trial was not happening or relevant in any way? Was Jim under a serious (legal?) obligation to take the pills, more than usual for someone on medication? Is an interaction with another medication relevant?

Is either man - especially Jim - involved in any way with any type of lawsuit about the drug? Perhaps a lawsuit about failing to divulge a side effect, or failing to find out about the side effect before the medication was given to Jim? Did Jim lie to anyone relevant, like a medical or legal professional, about not taking the pills?

Was anyone else's life directly impacted by Jim not taking the pills, and if so was this within days? Weeks? Or much later? Does Jim not qualify for anything as a result of not taking the pills for several days? Was Jim not able to do something relevant for work, play, or other obligations as a result of not taking the pills?

Is there a possibility of Jim going to jail in the future? Is that relevant? Can I invoke a sort of [LTPF List of Crimes/Things to be Sued or Detained For] if Jim is in legal trouble?

Sorry if any are mildly redundant, but I bet that's a standard disclaimer around these parts.
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby irishelk » Sat Nov 18, 2017 2:58 pm

biograd

Was the medication for arthritis a narcotic painkiller? Painkiller aspect irr, but... a non-narcotic medication such as an anti-inflammatory? Yes! Relevant? Yes! If the same medication were taken for another painful condition (not rheumatoid arthritis), would the situation be the same? Yes. What if it were taken for a non-painful condition (provided taking the drug would make sense for that)? Yes.

Is the relevant effect of stopping the medication that the arthritis itself would get worse? Yesish. or something unrelated to that?

You said that Jim was not abusing the medication, nor did Mike think he was, but is the abuse of narcotics more broadly relevant? No.

WAG: Jim's medication WAS a narcotic, and someone thought he was selling his pills, but if stopping them made his arthritis measurably worse, this would prove that he had been taking and not selling them. So no. Good thought though.

Assuming it's NOT this, does the effect of stopping the medication, nevertheless, prove something? Indirectly...yope.


dukhsan

With drug tests as a no, does this confirm a clinical trial was not happening or relevant in any way? Correct. Was Jim under a serious (legal?) obligation to take the pills, more than usual for someone on medication? No. Is an interaction with another medication relevant? No.

Is either man - especially Jim - involved in any way with any type of lawsuit about the drug? No. Perhaps a lawsuit about failing to divulge a side effect, or failing to find out about the side effect before the medication was given to Jim? Did Jim lie to anyone relevant, like a medical or legal professional, about not taking the pills? Not relevantly, but he probably didn't tell certain people.

Was anyone else's life directly impacted by Jim not taking the pills, DOYD ["depends on your definition"] of impact, but I'd say yes. and if so was this within days? Weeks? Or much later? The biggest result happened a few months later.
Does Jim not qualify for anything as a result of not taking the pills for several days? Noish. Was Jim not able to do something relevant for work, play, or other obligations as a result of not taking the pills? Yes, definitely not able to do something, though not for work or fun.

Is there a possibility of Jim going to jail in the future? Yes! Is that relevant? Yes. Can I invoke a sort of [LTPF List of Crimes/Things to be Sued or Detained For] if Jim is in legal trouble? Sure: murder, two counts! Good question.

Sorry if any are mildly redundant, but I bet that's a standard disclaimer around these parts. Nah, you did great, and welcome! (or welcome back, right? I seem to remember you from days of old)
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby dukhsan » Sat Nov 18, 2017 9:25 pm

So Jim murdered people, I'd assume two of them. Not accidentally, which would be manslaughter or something, but completely on purpose? Was it premeditated, and if so how long did he plan it? Were the victims at all related to the medication he was taking, i.e. they developed it, sold it, prescribed it? Were the victims friends, family, law enforcement, completely random, something else entirely? Did other people who stopped the medication subsequently commit any crime, perhaps also murder?

Did not taking the medication affect Jim's mental state in a way that would make him commit murder, or any crime in general, perhaps by making him much more irritable or affecting mood some other way? Did Jim gain the ability or desire to do anything specific by not taking the medication?

I know I was around here with a different username in 2011 or so. Otherwise I posted some puzzles on the XKCD forums before that.
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby irishelk » Sun Nov 19, 2017 1:25 pm

dukhsan

So Jim murdered people, I'd assume two of them. That's...a great question. I'll say yes, with an asterisk that will become clear later.
Not accidentally, which would be manslaughter or something, but completely on purpose? Yes. Was it premeditated, and if so how long did he plan it? Unknown/irr. Were the victims at all related to the medication he was taking, i.e. they developed it, sold it, prescribed it? No. Were the victims friends, family, law enforcement, completely random, something else entirely? One family-ish, one stranger. Exact relationships irr., but might help you. Did other people who stopped the medication subsequently commit any crime, perhaps also murder? No, possible FA.

Did not taking the medication affect Jim's mental state in a way that would make him commit murder, or any crime in general, perhaps by making him much more irritable or affecting mood some other way? No. Did Jim gain the ability or desire to do anything specific by not taking the medication? Yope to ability.

I know I was around here with a different username in 2011 or so. Otherwise I posted some puzzles on the XKCD forums before that. Maybe that's it!
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby Balin » Sun Nov 19, 2017 5:52 pm

I do remember seeing your name around here, Dukhsan. Welcome back!

By any chance, does Jim talk in his sleep? Is he in danger of unknowingly admitting his crime?
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby irishelk » Mon Nov 20, 2017 11:56 am

Balin

By any chance, does Jim talk in his sleep? Is he in danger of unknowingly admitting his crime? No, but good thought!
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby dukhsan » Mon Nov 20, 2017 10:29 pm

So from the perspective of the victims, Jim just outright killed them out of nowhere? Was the exact murder weapon relevant? If so, I'll ask for each of the [list of weapons]. Was he inspired to kill the victims based on something they had done to him? Or based on something different that happened to Jim? Did the victims anger Jim either at the moment of their death or sometime before, or inspire any other particular emotion in him?

Was Jim's health long-term compromised by not taking the med for a few days? Short-term compromised?
Was his ability or inability to drive a car relevant at a certain time? Given that it's murder, he doesn't seem to have lost control of something which resulted in the victims' deaths, but is something like that vaguely on the right track?

Is Mike relevant to the rest of the puzzle after making the initial suggestion - AKA does he do anything else important besides that suggestion? If so, would that be days, weeks, months later?
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby irishelk » Tue Nov 21, 2017 11:14 pm

dukhsan

So from the perspective of the victims, Jim just outright killed them out of nowhere? Yes (with the tiny asterisk that you can ignore for now). Was the exact murder weapon relevant? No. If so, I'll ask for each of the [list of weapons]. Was he inspired to kill the victims based on something they had done to him? Or based on something different that happened to Jim? Irr/Unknown. Did the victims anger Jim either at the moment of their death or sometime before, or inspire any other particular emotion in him? Not relevantly, but we can assume he was angry at them.

Was Jim's health long-term compromised by not taking the med for a few days? No. Short-term compromised? Yes, in one way.
Was his ability or inability to drive a car relevant at a certain time? No. Given that it's murder, he doesn't seem to have lost control of something which resulted in the victims' deaths, but is something like that vaguely on the right track? No, FA lurking.

Is Mike relevant to the rest of the puzzle after making the initial suggestion - AKA does he do anything else important besides that suggestion? No, other than regretting the decision. If so, would that be days, weeks, months later? Years.
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby Balin » Thu Nov 23, 2017 1:18 pm

Were Jim's crimes premeditated? Impulsive?
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby irishelk » Thu Nov 23, 2017 5:57 pm

Balin

Were Jim's crimes premeditated? Impulsive? Irr. And, in fact, unknown.
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby Balin » Thu Nov 23, 2017 6:12 pm

Did the medication impact his muscles? Did they limit his ability to do something? Make it more possible for him to do something?
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby irishelk » Fri Nov 24, 2017 1:55 pm

Balin

Did the medication impact his muscles? Not relevantly. Did they limit his ability to do something? YES. Make it more possible for him to do something? No.
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby dukhsan » Sun Nov 26, 2017 3:37 am

Is the exact medication (or a withdrawal of this med) relevant for its ability to limit certain actions, such that no other medication would have led to this exact result? Is the rarity or commonness of a (withdrawal) side effect relevant?

For Jim's specific limited ability to do something, was he not able to (or had limited ability to) speak, eat, stay out of danger, drive, make a specific arm or leg movement, breathe, regulate his emotions or general comfort, care for someone else, access a building, make a phone call or e-mail, purchase important things, maintain relationships with others, or regulate his finances (not necessarily the same as not being able to work)? [A weird pile of thoughts, but hey, just in case.]
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby irishelk » Sun Nov 26, 2017 3:37 pm

dukhsan

Is the exact medication (or a withdrawal of this med) relevant for its ability to limit certain actions, such that no other medication would have led to this exact result? To clarify: the withdrawal, not the medications, limited the ability. Given that, only a medication for his particular symptoms/condition would lead to the same result.
Is the rarity or commonness of a (withdrawal) side effect relevant? Not really.

For Jim's specific limited ability to do something, was he not able to (or had limited ability to) speak, eat, stay out of danger, drive, make a specific arm or leg movement, This is closest, but not exactly. breathe, regulate his emotions or general comfort, care for someone else, access a building, make a phone call or e-mail, purchase important things, maintain relationships with others, or regulate his finances (not necessarily the same as not being able to work)? [A weird pile of thoughts, but hey, just in case.] It was a good pile.
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby dukhsan » Mon Nov 27, 2017 12:48 am

So that basically means I don't have to check every Wikipedia article on rheumatoid arthritis medications, correct? Nor do I need to know a complete list of symptoms that patients suffer before even attempting these questions? (Can't be too sure, it's a very interesting and tricky puzzle.)

Is the withdrawal symptom something arthritis does and the med typically prevented? Or came about from his body reacting to a lack of medication, if different?

Could he not walk? Jump? Run/jog? Hold an item? Punch/strike/kick something? Pull/push something? Do a more complicated activity, such as operating a control panel or something with his feet that wasn't driving vehicles?
Did he try to do something that he normally took for granted and the lack of ability surprised him?
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby irishelk » Mon Nov 27, 2017 1:23 pm

dukhsan

So that basically means I don't have to check every Wikipedia article on rheumatoid arthritis medications, correct? Nor do I need to know a complete list of symptoms that patients suffer before even attempting these questions? Nope, any relevant bits about what the medication does have been discovered above. (Can't be too sure, it's a very interesting and tricky puzzle.) I think you be happy with the answer--at least, I hope so. :)

Is the withdrawal symptom something arthritis does and the med typically prevented? Yes. Or came about from his body reacting to a lack of medication, if different? No (though it might return quicker/worse due to withdrawal).

Could he not walk? Jump? Run/jog? Hold an item? This is close, but... Punch/strike/kick something? Pull/push something? Do a more complicated activity, such as operating a control panel or something with his feet that wasn't driving vehicles? It's a little more complicated, yes.
Did he try to do something that he normally took for granted and the lack of ability surprised him? No.
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby Balin » Mon Nov 27, 2017 11:52 pm

Could he not close his hand? Open his hand?
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby dukhsan » Thu Nov 30, 2017 7:20 pm

Was inflammation of the arms/legs interfering with a series of movements in a more complicated action? Was he driving a train, flying an airplane, transporting passengers in general, riding a bicycle? Did someone else's action contribute to the side effect's nastiness, such as touching him on a part of his body that caused pain, or injured him in a place that was already vulnerable to arthritis?

Is the puzzle's title a significant hint? If so, did Jim have nowhere to hide from someone or something? Or does it refer to another thing entirely?

Were the victims Jim killed found minutes, hours, days, weeks, etc. after dying? Does this matter? Were they killed in a public place? Were their deaths the thing that happened a few months after Jim had the lapse in taking pills? Did they do something to Jim without realizing it, possibly significantly before they died?
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby irishelk » Sat Dec 02, 2017 12:20 pm

Balin

Could he not close his hand? Open his hand? Not these.


dukhsan

Was inflammation of the arms/legs interfering with a series of movements in a more complicated action? Yesish, but "interfering with movement" might give the wrong impression. Was he driving a train, flying an airplane, transporting passengers in general, riding a bicycle? No to all. Did someone else's action contribute to the side effect's nastiness, In a sense... such as touching him on a part of his body that caused pain, or injured him in a place that was already vulnerable to arthritis? But not like this.

Is the puzzle's title a significant hint? It's a very obscure one and probably not helpful. You're welcome. =)If so, did Jim have nowhere to hide from someone or something? No. Or does it refer to another thing entirely? Yes.

Were the victims Jim killed found minutes, hours, days, weeks, etc. after dying? Does this matter? Around an hour I believe, irr. Were they killed in a public place? No, irr. Were their deaths the thing that happened a few months after Jim had the lapse in taking pills? NO, good q. Did they do something to Jim without realizing it, possibly significantly before they died? No.

I think the timing of events would be helpful to clarify.
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby Balin » Sat Dec 02, 2017 4:16 pm

Had Jim committed the murders (all of them?) before Mike's suggestion?
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby irishelk » Sun Dec 03, 2017 6:52 pm

Balin

Had Jim committed the murders (all of them?) before Mike's suggestion? Yes!
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby dukhsan » Sun Dec 03, 2017 8:03 pm

In this case, did Jim not taking the medication lead to him getting caught, convicted, or otherwise tied to the murders?

Did Mike have any involvement in the murders himself, or know about them?
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby irishelk » Mon Dec 04, 2017 1:24 pm

dukhsan

In this case, did Jim not taking the medication lead to him getting caught, convicted, or otherwise tied to the murders? No, explore.

Did Mike have any involvement in the murders himself, No. or know about them? Yes.
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby dukhsan » Tue Dec 05, 2017 8:54 pm

Was Mike helping to cover up the murders? Does it matter that he knew about them? Are there other people especially involved in this, to the degree that we need to find out who they are?

Is Jim's legal trouble due to some action revealing that he perpetrated the murders months or years before? Had he gotten away with them until then? Did Jim not taking his medication lead to some other event which made people take notice of him?

Is the exact effect of Jim not taking the medication necessary to solve the puzzle? Or is it just helpful?
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby irishelk » Wed Dec 06, 2017 6:05 pm

dukhsan

Was Mike helping to cover up the murders? Not exactly, but close. Does it matter that he knew about them? Yes. Are there other people especially involved in this, to the degree that we need to find out who they are? Only in that they take part in the larger situation occurring.

Is Jim's legal trouble due to some action revealing that he perpetrated the murders months or years before? No. Had he gotten away with them until then? No, he was arrested immediately after the crimes. Did Jim not taking his medication lead to some other event which made people take notice of him? No.

Is the exact effect of Jim not taking the medication necessary to solve the puzzle? Yes. Or is it just helpful?
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby Balin » Wed Dec 06, 2017 7:16 pm

Had Jim been on trial for the crimes? Convicted? Was his trial ongoing?
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby dukhsan » Wed Dec 06, 2017 11:33 pm

Did everything with the medication happen when Jim was in jail, having already been convicted? Was some action Jim was taking while in jail hampered by not taking the medication? Perhaps he was hindered by adverse effects while trying to escape from his confinement, or during a fight, parole hearing, etc.?

Was Mike trying to accomplish something specific with the medication advice besides Jim's everyday health, such as Jim not taking the medication to appear more ill than he really was? To have Jim appear more incapable of committing murder (or any other crime) than he really was?
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby irishelk » Sat Dec 09, 2017 4:38 pm

Balin

Had Jim been on trial for the crimes? Yes. Convicted? No. Was his trial ongoing? Yes.


dukhsan

Did everything with the medication happen when Jim was in jail, having already been convicted? No. Was some action Jim was taking while in jail hampered by not taking the medication? Perhaps he was hindered by adverse effects while trying to escape from his confinement, or during a fight, parole hearing, etc.? No to rest.

Was Mike trying to accomplish something specific with the medication advice besides Jim's everyday health, Yes... such as Jim not taking the medication to appear more ill than he really was? Noish. To have Jim appear more incapable of committing murder (or any other crime) than he really was? Yope to yesish.
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby Balin » Sat Dec 09, 2017 9:45 pm

Did the suggestion lead to Jim's conviction? Wrongful acquittal?
Was Mike trying to make it look like Jim could not have committed the murders? Because of his physical state? Because he could not have been at the place where the murders were committed (because he could not travel, for instance)?
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby irishelk » Sun Dec 10, 2017 12:14 pm

Balin

Did the suggestion lead to Jim's conviction? No. Wrongful acquittal? YES.
Was Mike trying to make it look like Jim could not have committed the murders? Yesish. Because of his physical state? In a sense, yes... Because he could not have been at the place where the murders were committed (because he could not travel, for instance)? Not like this.
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby Balin » Sun Dec 10, 2017 2:02 pm

Did the lack of medication relevantly impact a specific part of his body?
Have we established the exact murder method? Is the exact murder method relevant? Is anything about the victims relevant? Were all victims killed the same way?
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby irishelk » Thu Dec 14, 2017 5:20 pm

Balin

Did the lack of medication relevantly impact a specific part of his body? YES.
Have we established the exact murder method? No, it's stabbing. Is the exact murder method relevant? Not really, though I suppose there are some that are unlikely. Is anything about the victims relevant? No more than already discovered. Were all victims killed the same way? Yes (just two).
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby MiserableLie » Thu Dec 14, 2017 9:23 pm

Is Mike Jim's lawyer?

Edit: going to PM you as something's just clicked in my head.
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Re: [IrishElk] No Place to Hide

Postby irishelk » Fri Dec 15, 2017 1:01 am

MiserableLie

Is Mike Jim's lawyer? YES.

Edit: going to PM you as something's just clicked in my head
You got it!
And interestingly, technically the answer to your question is no. This story has been told by the lawyer involved as if it was his idea, but the "Mike" I was referring to was another person, who claims credit for the suggestion. Doesn't really matter for the puzzle though: it was a person involved in his defense team.
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