[WiZ] I had a clever title, then I reworded the question

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[WiZ] I had a clever title, then I reworded the question

Postby WiZ » Tue Oct 24, 2017 2:06 am

Eve sets out one morning with a basket of fruit, intent on earning some money. Over the course of the day, she gives the fruit away for free to several strangers. She then goes home, having made over a hundred dollars. What does she do?

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Last edited by WiZ on Mon Nov 06, 2017 10:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: [WiZ] I had a clever title, then I reworded the question

Postby GalFisk » Tue Oct 24, 2017 7:19 am

Relevant what sort of fruit? Is the fruit worth a hundred dollars? Less? More? Is she advertising something? Is she getting the money from the people to whom she gave the fruits? Relevant how many fruits she had? How many stranges she gave them to? Did she give one to each? Did the strangers: eat the fruit? Take it home? Use it to make food? Give it to others? Throw it away? Sell it? Give it away? Give it back to Eve? Plant the seeds? Is she committing a crime? Is someone else? Is she undercutting a fruit seller? Does a fruit seller pay her to go away? Is one fruit seller paying her for sabotaging for another fruit seller? Does she run a relevant business? Is extortion relevant?
WAG: does she give away poisoned fruit, wait until it's eaten, and then charge money for the antidote?
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Re: [WiZ] I had a clever title, then I reworded the question

Postby Earnest » Tue Oct 24, 2017 7:38 am

Eve = H/A/F?
Is her main intent to earn money by selling the fruit?
Relevant that she gave the fruit to strangers? Could it work also eith her mum for instance? With a friend?


If not, is fruit relevant to make a trick? A magic trick? Is fruit part of a show? After she gave fruit to strangers did they give it back to eve in minutes?

Did she give the fruit to strangers for free just if they had bought something before? (E.g. as an incentive to buy...)

Wag...did eve sell products connected to botany and gave seed for free to strangers if they bought (or as an incentive to buy) her products first?
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Re: [WiZ] I had a clever title, then I reworded the question

Postby WiZ » Tue Oct 24, 2017 7:53 pm

GalFisk

Relevant what sort of fruit? no Is the fruit worth a hundred dollars? no Less? yes ? Is she advertising something? no Is she getting the money from the people to whom she gave the fruits? no Relevant how many fruits she had? no; assume a small number How many stranges she gave them to? no; assume a dozen or so Did she give one to each? yes Did the strangers: eat the fruit? no Take it home? no Use it to make food? no Give it to others? no Throw it away? no Sell it? no Give it away? no Give it back to Eve? yes Plant the seeds? no

I think we now have the official LTPF List of things people can do with fruit. Kudos.

Is she committing a crime? no Is someone else? almost Is she undercutting a fruit seller? no Does a fruit seller pay her to go away? no Is one fruit seller paying her for sabotaging for another fruit seller? no Does she run a relevant business? no Is extortion relevant? no
WAG: does she give away poisoned fruit, wait until it's eaten, and then charge money for the antidote? No, but this is some beautiful lateral thinking

Earnest

Eve = H/A/F? yes to all
Is her main intent to earn money by selling the fruit? no
Relevant that she gave the fruit to strangers? circumstances were that they would most probably be strangers Could it work also eith her mum for instance? With a friend? yes to both (although less likely)

If not, is fruit relevant to make a trick? no A magic trick? no Is fruit part of a show? no After she gave fruit to strangers did they give it back to eve in minutes? yes

Did she give the fruit to strangers for free just if they had bought something before? (E.g. as an incentive to buy...) no

Wag...did eve sell products connected to botany and gave seed for free to strangers if they bought (or as an incentive to buy) her products first? no, but a nice lateral guess
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Re: [WiZ] I had a clever title, then I reworded the question

Postby GalFisk » Wed Oct 25, 2017 4:39 am

Did she give any fruit to more than one person? Did she wait until she got one back before giving away the next? Did she ask the strangers if they wanted the fruit before giving it? Did tge strangers expect to be giving the fruit back when they received it? Were they happy to give it back? Did they want to keep it? Eat it? Were they relevantly seen receiving it? Giving it back? Did those who received the fruit almost commit a crime? Did she get the money from one person? Was the money payment for a product? A service? Was it given willingly? Grudgingly? Was the payment(s) relevantly seen? Not seen? Did she know how much money she'd get when she set out in the morning? Did she take the fruit home?
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Re: [WiZ] I had a clever title, then I reworded the question

Postby Earnest » Wed Oct 25, 2017 7:53 am

Did she earn the money before giving the fruit to strangers? Before they give it back to her? After they give it back?

Could the puzzle work in modern times? Middle age?

Does Eve know to which strangers she gave the fruit? Or we can suppose that she randomly give fruit and then go to a relevant place where all the strangers having received a fruit give it back to her?
Is the fruit that strangers give back to her in the same conditions of the fruit they are given by Eve? (E.g. if eve give a person an intact apple, the apple will be gi en back intact as it was when Eve gave it to the stranger)

Fruit = ripe edible fruit? Same type of fruit?(e.g. all apples? Bananas?...) was the fruit in pieces?(e.g. pieces if water melon?...) mainly intact? Did strangers need fruit? If so...was there an event explaining the need of fruit?

Did she need strangers to bite the fruit?
...stupid wag...were the strangers mainly children and she made them eat apples to throw away their baby teeth?
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Re: [WiZ] I had a clever title, then I reworded the question

Postby WiZ » Wed Oct 25, 2017 8:46 pm

GalFisk

Did she give any fruit to more than one person? quite possibly, yes Did she wait until she got one back before giving away the next? yes Did she ask the strangers if they wanted the fruit before giving it? yesish Did tge strangers expect to be giving the fruit back when they received it? yes Were they happy to give it back? yes Did they want to keep it? no Eat it? no Were they relevantly seen receiving it? no Giving it back? no Did those who received the fruit almost commit a crime? yope to yesish Did she get the money from one person? yesish, DOYD of 'person' Was the money payment for a product? A service? this Was it given willingly? this Grudgingly? Was the payment(s) relevantly seen? no Not seen? no Did she know how much money she'd get when she set out in the morning? yes Did she take the fruit home? possibly, although she would necessarily have to replace them fairly often

Earnest

Did she earn the money before giving the fruit to strangers? Before they give it back to her? After they give it back? this

Could the puzzle work in modern times? yes Middle age? No; this specific set of circumstances is modern, although variants of all the components have existed for centuries

Does Eve know to which strangers she gave the fruit? yes Or we can suppose that she randomly give fruit and then go to a relevant place where all the strangers having received a fruit give it back to her? no
Is the fruit that strangers give back to her in the same conditions of the fruit they are given by Eve? (E.g. if eve give a person an intact apple, the apple will be gi en back intact as it was when Eve gave it to the stranger) yes (although the fruit will eventually degrade as fruit is wont to do)

Fruit = ripe edible fruit? yes Same type of fruit?(e.g. all apples? Bananas?...) not relevantly was the fruit in pieces?(e.g. pieces if water melon?...) no mainly intact? yes Did strangers need fruit? no If so...was there an event explaining the need of fruit? no

Did she need strangers to bite the fruit? no
...stupid wag...were the strangers mainly children and she made them eat apples to throw away their baby teeth? no
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Re: [WiZ] I had a clever title, then I reworded the question

Postby Balin » Thu Oct 26, 2017 2:01 am

Does she give the fruit to strangers at their homes? At a public place? Relevant?
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Re: [WiZ] I had a clever title, then I reworded the question

Postby WiZ » Thu Oct 26, 2017 2:37 am

Does she give the fruit to strangers at their homes? no At a public place? yes Relevant? yes
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Re: [WiZ] I had a clever title, then I reworded the question

Postby Earnest » Thu Oct 26, 2017 7:05 am

Mmm...ok...so was there a piece of string bounded to the fruit?
Did she give the fruit to one stranger per time? So for instance if she had 12 fruits she gave a different fruit to each one of the 12 strangers? or did she give the fruit to all the strangers at the same time?

So strangers just touch the fruit with their hands? Or also with other parts of body (head? Legs? Mouth?) Than give it back? If so, does Eve say something in the meanwhile? Something about the fruit? A metaphoric sentence involving fruit? Make a guess? Did she bet something with the stranger and win? Is Eve committing a sort of crime?

Strangers give money for a service...so a service that Eve make to them directly? A service that is provided inmediately or that will be provided?
Is Eve part of an association? Relevant who has coltivated the fruit? Where it has been cultivated? Did Eve say to them that the fruit increase the quality of the service she provides?

Try to guess the service: a prediction? Is the service based on how the stranger hold the fruit (also depending on the shape of the fruit)? A guess?
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Re: [WiZ] I had a clever title, then I reworded the question

Postby WiZ » Thu Oct 26, 2017 8:28 pm

Mmm...ok...so was there a piece of string bounded to the fruit? no
Did she give the fruit to one stranger per time? yes So for instance if she had 12 fruits she gave a different fruit to each one of the 12 strangers? yes or did she give the fruit to all the strangers at the same time? no

So strangers just touch the fruit with their hands? no! Or also with other parts of body (head? Legs? Mouth?) not this, either Than give it back? yes If so, does Eve say something in the meanwhile? yes[/color] Something about the fruit? yesA metaphoric sentence involving fruit? no Make a guess? no Did she bet something with the stranger and win? no Is Eve committing a sort of crime? no

Strangers give money for a service...so a service that Eve make to them directly? yes A service that is provided inmediately yes or that will be provided? no
Is Eve part of an association? yes Relevant who has coltivated the fruit? no Where it has been cultivated? no Did Eve say to them that the fruit increase the quality of the service she provides? yes, more or less

Try to guess the service: a prediction? no Is the service based on how the stranger hold the fruit (also depending on the shape of the fruit)? no A guess? no
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Re: [WiZ] I had a clever title, then I reworded the question

Postby CoffeeBean » Thu Oct 26, 2017 8:37 pm

When Eve performs the relevant actions mentioned and not mentioned, is she carrying anything else besides fruit? Is she alone, or accompanied by anyone?
The people who she gives the fruit to do not touch it with their hands at all? Or just initially?
Do the recipients know that Eve is giving them fruit? Or is she "slipping it" to them, somehow passing it without their knowledge?
If Eve met a man named, let's say "Adam", today, and went through the progression of actions that she does with the fruit, is it conceivable that she would do the same thing with Adam again tomorrow? In a few days? Ever again?
Does Eve get money from her employer? Or is she basically self-employed?
Is the money gotten by trading something for it? By Eve performing a service for a person or people?
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Re: [WiZ] I had a clever title, then I reworded the question

Postby WiZ » Thu Oct 26, 2017 9:02 pm

When Eve performs the relevant actions mentioned and not mentioned, is she carrying anything else besides fruit? no Is she alone, or accompanied by anyone? she is accompanied
The people who she gives the fruit to do not touch it with their hands at all? incorrect - they hand it back Or just initially? correct
Do the recipients know that Eve is giving them fruit? yes Or is she "slipping it" to them, somehow passing it without their knowledge? no
If Eve met a man named, let's say "Adam", today, and went through the progression of actions that she does with the fruit, is it conceivable that she would do the same thing with Adam again tomorrow? extremely unlikely In a few days? highly unlikely Ever again? statistically still unlikely
Does Eve get money from her employer? yes Or is she basically self-employed? no
Is the money gotten by trading something for it? no By Eve performing a service for a person or people? yes
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Re: [WiZ] I had a clever title, then I reworded the question

Postby Acridian9 » Fri Oct 27, 2017 9:30 am

Is this Halloween related?
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Re: [WiZ] I had a clever title, then I reworded the question

Postby Earnest » Sat Oct 28, 2017 8:49 am

do they give back the fruit all the same time? Is there a table? Relevant? Does she take the fruit away from the basket in assigning it to each stranger? Relevant? Can we say that she "assigns" a fruit to each stranger? If so, does she assign a random fruit to a random stranger or she carefully choose which fruit to assign to each stranger? Does she relevantly ask the name of each stranger? Can she change the order of the fruit assigned to each stranger?

E.g. suppose
stranger A --> apple
stranger B--> banana
stranger C-->coconut

She changes into
stranger A --> banana
stranger B--> coconut
stranger C--> apple

did each stranger pay the same amount of money after having given back the fruit? If not, did each stranger pay a different amount depending on the type of fruit assigned?

Can each stranger see which fruit he is assigned? Which fruit the others are assigned? do they know it is fruit? Does she focus on each stranger per time in what she does?
Strangers...do they have something in common (e.g. profession...)? does Eve think they have something in common?

Service provided related to: health care? does she teach them something (e.g. posture)? service related to entertainment (e.g. they need to dunk in the basket)? did she explain the rules of a game they have to perform in giving her back the fruit? is the act of giving the fruit back per se relevant because they touch the fruit assigned for the first time? is fruit and "not to touch fruit" relevant to make a point?

Did they give her money cash? With credit cards? Other means of payment? Relevant?
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Re: [WiZ] I had a clever title, then I reworded the question

Postby Grouffe » Sat Oct 28, 2017 11:35 am

Do the people receiving the fruit get some kind of warning of discomfort if they don't give the fruit back? And if they don't pay?

Do the people receiving the fruit get something back for donating their money? If so, anything physical? Valuable? Some kind words or just a thank you? A blessing? Do they expect to get something back, or is this only a deed of beneficience?
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Re: [WiZ] I had a clever title, then I reworded the question

Postby GalFisk » Sat Oct 28, 2017 5:16 pm

Did the people say something relevant about the fruit? Do something relevant with it except giving it back? Was all the fruit perfectly ripe? Were the fruits at different levels of ripeness? Is she conducting a survey? Are people who are given fruits writing something relevant?
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Re: [WiZ] I had a clever title, then I reworded the question

Postby WiZ » Sun Oct 29, 2017 8:18 pm

Acridian

Is this Halloween related? no

Earnest

do they give back the fruit all the same time? no Is there a table? yes Relevant? no Does she take the fruit away from the basket in assigning it to each stranger? yes Relevant? no Can we say that she "assigns" a fruit to each stranger? yes If so, does she assign a random fruit to a random stranger this or she carefully choose which fruit to assign to each stranger? no Does she relevantly ask the name of each stranger? no Can she change the order of the fruit assigned to each stranger? yes

E.g. suppose
stranger A --> apple
stranger B--> banana
stranger C-->coconut

She changes into
stranger A --> banana
stranger B--> coconut
stranger C--> apple

This would be perfectly acceptable.

did each stranger pay the same amount of money after having given back the fruit? FA to both If not, did each stranger pay a different amount depending on the type of fruit assigned? FA to both

Can each stranger see which fruit he is assigned? yes Which fruit the others are assigned? no do they know it is fruit? yes Does she focus on each stranger per time in what she does? yes
Strangers...do they have something in common yes (e.g. profession... but not this)? does Eve think they have something in common? yes

Service provided related to: health care? no does she teach them something (e.g. posture)? She does not teach the strangers anything service related to entertainment (e.g. they need to dunk in the basket)? no (although that sounds like fun) did she explain the rules of a game they have to perform in giving her back the fruit? no is the act of giving the fruit back per se relevant because they touch the fruit assigned for the first time? no is fruit and "not to touch fruit" relevant to make a point? no

Did they give her money cash? With credit cards? Other means of payment? FA to all Relevant? Knowing how/from whom she gets the money may help

Grouffe

Do the people receiving the fruit get some kind of warning of discomfort if they don't give the fruit back? probably, yes And if they don't pay? FA

Do the people receiving the fruit get something back for donating their money? FA If so, anything physical? Valuable? Some kind words or just a thank you? A blessing? n/a - see above Do they expect to get something back, or is this only a deed of beneficience? they will not personally receive any direct benefit from this

GalFisk

Did the people say something relevant about the fruit? no Do something relevant with it except giving it back? no Was all the fruit perfectly ripe? more or less Were the fruits at different levels of ripeness? no/irrel Is she conducting a survey? no Are people who are given fruits writing something relevant? no
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Re: [WiZ] I had a clever title, then I reworded the question

Postby Balin » Sun Oct 29, 2017 11:44 pm

Are the fruit recipients also giving fruit to Eve?
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Re: [WiZ] I had a clever title, then I reworded the question

Postby WiZ » Sun Oct 29, 2017 11:58 pm

Are the fruit recipients also giving fruit to Eve? Outside of returning the fruit she game them, no
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Re: [WiZ] I had a clever title, then I reworded the question

Postby Earnest » Mon Oct 30, 2017 9:38 am

Are the payments money made?
Did the strangers "pay" her in order to "protect them"? Is the service given as soon as they accepted to take the fruit?

Is something illegal going on? Is accepting the fruit from eve somehow illegal? Does she make it illegal? Relevant where they are?
Are the strangers also foreigners?

Is there someone taking pictures? Are fruits GMO?
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Re: [WiZ] I had a clever title, then I reworded the question

Postby WiZ » Mon Oct 30, 2017 7:39 pm

Are the payments money made? Please rephrase
Did the strangers "pay" her in order to "protect them"? no Is the service given as soon as they accepted to take the fruit? no

Is something illegal going on? no Is accepting the fruit from eve somehow illegal? no, not from Eve Does she make it illegal? quite the opposite Relevant where they are? yes!
Are the strangers also foreigners? quite potentially, yes

Is there someone taking pictures? no Are fruits GMO? no, but ORT
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Re: [WiZ] I had a clever title, then I reworded the question

Postby Balin » Tue Oct 31, 2017 10:28 pm

They are at a public place - a business? A currency exchange? An airport? Somewhere frequented by tourists?
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Re: [WiZ] I had a clever title, then I reworded the question

Postby Earnest » Thu Nov 02, 2017 9:50 am

Where they are relevant...does it mean that it is relevant the specific place where they are or the country? (E.g. a country where a certain action is forbidden...) a place where the action, which is generally illegal, is made legal? If so, is the action of giving the fruit back relevant to make the action legal? Is a certain chemical substance adopted on the fruits?
Does Eve want ti show something? That something is danger? That something is not? Is agriculture relevant? Use of chemicals in agriculture? Did Eve wear gloves when touching the fruit and the strangers no?
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Re: [WiZ] I had a clever title, then I reworded the question

Postby WiZ » Thu Nov 02, 2017 10:46 pm

Balin

They are at a public place - a business? A currency exchange? An airport? this! Somewhere frequented by tourists? this, too, I suppose

Earnest

Where they are relevant...does it mean that it is relevant the specific place where they are yes or the country? no (E.g. a country where a certain action is forbidden...) a place where the action, which is generally illegal, is made legal? it is not by virtue of the place alone that the action is made legal

If so, is the action of giving the fruit back relevant to make the action legal? no Is a certain chemical substance adopted on the fruits? no
Does Eve want ti show something? not really That something is danger? no That something is not? no Is agriculture relevant? yes, although a little indirectly Use of chemicals in agriculture? not really Did Eve wear gloves when touching the fruit and the strangers no? this is not key to the solution
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Re: [WiZ] I had a clever title, then I reworded the question

Postby Earnest » Fri Nov 03, 2017 8:33 am

Airport...so...were the strangers about to take a plane? Or were them just landed?

Did Eve work for the airport? Are the dimensions of the fruit relevant? Security measures relevant? Drugs? Can it be considered a control? A sell? An exchange?

Is Customs (hope it is clear) relevant? International transactions? Action of giving back the fruit relevant (e.g. sonething like "since strangers give the fruit back to Eve, the fruit can be considered foreign fruit"?)
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Re: [WiZ] I had a clever title, then I reworded the question

Postby WiZ » Sun Nov 05, 2017 7:29 pm

Airport...so...were the strangers about to take a plane? Or were them just landed? this

Did Eve work for the airport? yes Are the dimensions of the fruit relevant? no Security measures relevant? yes Drugs? no Can it be considered a control? yes A sell? An exchange? no to these

Is Customs (hope it is clear) relevant? Yes, very International transactions? no Action of giving back the fruit relevant (e.g. sonething like "since strangers give the fruit back to Eve, the fruit can be considered foreign fruit"?) no

Good round of questions.
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Re: [WiZ] I had a clever title, then I reworded the question

Postby peter365 » Mon Nov 06, 2017 9:52 am

Does this take place in a country where it's illegal to bring in your own fruit? Is the fruit given to people who tried to bring in some but had it confiscated ? Is local fruit swapped for the fruit they brought in as a form of compensation?
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Re: [WiZ] I had a clever title, then I reworded the question

Postby Earnest » Mon Nov 06, 2017 5:47 pm

Has the fruit a certain reaction (chemical reaction?l if something illegal is going on? (if the hands of the stranger who take it back have residuals...)

Does the control happen at the moment when the fruit is given back?
If a stranger fails the control: he is unable to give the fruit back? He has difficulties in giving it back? The fruit modifies somehow?
Is it all a sort of "trap" to distract the stranger while another control is going on?
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Re: [WiZ] I had a clever title, then I reworded the question

Postby WiZ » Mon Nov 06, 2017 8:08 pm

Peter

Does this take place in a country where it's illegal to bring in your own fruit? Yes (I live in one such country) Is the fruit given to people who tried to bring in some but had it confiscated ? no Is local fruit swapped for the fruit they brought in as a form of compensation? no (customs staff are strongly disinclined to do any favours for people bringing fruit into the country!)

Earnest

Has the fruit a certain reaction (chemical reaction?l if something illegal is going on? (if the hands of the stranger who take it back have residuals...) no

Does the control happen at the moment when the fruit is given back? no
If a stranger fails the control FA - it is not the stranger being tested here : he is unable to give the fruit back? He has difficulties in giving it back? The fruit modifies somehow? no to these
Is it all a sort of "trap" to distract the stranger while another control is going on? no - in fact, this is a bit of a collaborative exercise...
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Re: [WiZ] I had a clever title, then I reworded the question

Postby Enjay » Mon Nov 06, 2017 9:44 pm

Does the person she gives the fruit to try to take it through customs? Is she testing the people whose job it is to stop people bringing fruit in, to see if they will detect the fruit? Testing a fruit-detecting machine? Fruit-detecting dog? (I'm sure those both exist...)
Is she working with the people she gives the fruit to? Are they also being paid? Are they fully aware of what and why Eve is doing what she is doing?
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Re: [WiZ] I had a clever title, then I reworded the question

Postby WiZ » Mon Nov 06, 2017 10:03 pm

Does the person she gives the fruit to try to take it through customs? yes Is she testing the people whose job it is to stop people bringing fruit in, to see if they will detect the fruit? not people, but... Testing a fruit-detecting machine? Fruit-detecting dog? yes! (I'm sure those both exist...)
Is she working with the people she gives the fruit to? she is collaborating with them, but they are doing their part voluntarily Are they also being paid? no Are they fully aware of what and why Eve is doing what she is doing? yes (after she has given them the explanation)

***** SPOILER *****

Eve is a Customs Officer, working at an airport in a country with strict bio-security laws (such as New Zealand). She is training a sniffer dog by consensually 'planting' a range of fruit in the hand luggage of arriving international passengers, and letting the dog identify it. She is paid a salary by the Customs service.


Based on an experience I had when I arrived at Wellington airport from Bangladesh in August (the fruit in question was a lemon). Our sniffer dogs also deal with drugs, of course, but they pose much less of a threat to our environment and economy. Congratulations to Enjay on the solve, Earnest for a lot of legwork, and everyone else for taking part.
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Re: [WiZ] I had a clever title, then I reworded the question

Postby Enjay » Mon Nov 06, 2017 10:12 pm

So what was your clever title...?
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Re: [WiZ] I had a clever title, then I reworded the question

Postby WiZ » Mon Nov 06, 2017 10:19 pm

It was initially called 'Throwing it all away', which is a song by Genesis. The original phrasing was about Eve handing Adam an apple which he threw away etc.
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Re: [WiZ] I had a clever title, then I reworded the question

Postby Earnest » Tue Nov 07, 2017 11:29 am

Wow...didn't have any idea about the existence of those dogs...clever puzzle!
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