[Balin] Obnoxious

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[Balin] Obnoxious

Postby Balin » Wed Jul 11, 2018 6:42 pm

Allie tells several strangers that she is a man. The strangers agree that she is a man, but this upsets Allie. Why?
I'll risk invoking the Quickie Paradox and say that I suspect this'll go speedily
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Re: [Balin] Obnoxious

Postby WiZ » Wed Jul 11, 2018 9:43 pm

Alex=HAF? All Shes = Alex? First use of 'man' = HAM? Second use?

Is she acting in her professional capacity? Is she acting or playing a role in some way? Does she interact with the strangers face-to-face? Do the strangers genuinely believe her when she tells them she is a man? Is Allie upset because she feels personally attacked by the insinuation that she is plausibly a man? Is this some sort of experiment that has not gone according to plan? Is there a relevant connection between the strangers, or the strangers and Alex? Would this puzzle work if Alex were a man, telling strangers that he was a woman?
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Re: [Balin] Obnoxious

Postby wolfier » Thu Jul 12, 2018 3:09 am

A "man" literally? Or "man" used as part of a longer word, e.g. fireman?
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Re: [Balin] Obnoxious

Postby Balin » Thu Jul 12, 2018 9:34 pm

Allie=HAF? HCF All Shes = Allie? Yes First use of 'man' = HAM? Yes Second use? Yes (HAM)

Is she acting in her professional capacity? No Is she acting No or playing a role in some way? Yes Does she interact with the strangers face-to-face? Yes Do the strangers genuinely believe her when she tells them she is a man? Yes in context, No in its strictest meaning Is Allie upset because she feels personally attacked by the insinuation that she is plausibly a man? No Is this some sort of experiment that has not gone according to plan? No Is there a relevant connection between the strangers, or the strangers and Allie? For svv of "connection" Would this puzzle work if Allie were a man, telling strangers that he was a woman? Not nearly as likely

A "man" literally? Yes Or "man" used as part of a longer word, e.g. fireman? No
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Re: [Balin] Obnoxious

Postby GalFisk » Fri Jul 13, 2018 10:17 am

Does she want them to belive that she is a man? Is she annoyed because they only believe her in context? Does she think they are being disingenuous? Does she want them to be harder to persuade?
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Re: [Balin] Obnoxious

Postby Earnest » Fri Jul 13, 2018 1:04 pm

Was Allie masked? Was Allie telling this to the strangers face to face with them? Were the strangers gathered together? Was she telling literally "Look, I'm a man!" referring literally to herself? Or does she refer to what she represebts (e.g. they were playing a game and she represents a man)? Do strangers firmly believe she was a man? Do strangers agree to make her happy? Was it war time? Is Allie upset because she had been recognized as a man? Had strangers disagreed would she have been happy? Was she playing a game with the strangers?
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Re: [Balin] Obnoxious

Postby Balin » Sat Jul 14, 2018 11:20 am

Does she want them to belive that she is a man? Yes, in context Is she annoyed because they only believe her in context? No Does she think they are being disingenuous? No Does she want them to be harder to persuade? No

Was Allie masked? No Was Allie telling this to the strangers face to face with them? Yes Were the strangers gathered together? No Was she telling literally "Look, I'm a man!" referring literally to herself? Not those exact words, but Yes, to herself (in context) Or does she refer to what she represents (e.g. they were playing a game and she represents a man)? Not like this, no Do strangers firmly believe she was a man? Yes, in context Do strangers agree to make her happy? Yes Was it war time? No Is Allie upset because she had been recognized as a man? No Had strangers disagreed would she have been happy? Probably not Was she playing a game with the strangers? No
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Re: [Balin] Obnoxious

Postby irishelk » Sun Jul 15, 2018 12:15 pm

Would she have been happy if they had said nothing? Does their speaking upset her? Their presence? Some non-verbal communication of theirs?

Is she doing this as part of her job? Is she at the strangers' place of work?

Is she saying she is a man in order to indicate that she is not a woman? That she is not a child? That she is human? Is she claiming to be a particular man? If so, by name? Halloween relevant?
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Re: [Balin] Obnoxious

Postby Balin » Sun Jul 15, 2018 7:44 pm

Would she have been happy if they had said nothing? Probably not Does their speaking upset her? It's what they say, not just that they speak Their presence? No Some non-verbal communication of theirs? No

Is she doing this as part of her job? Is she at the strangers' place of work? Neither

Is she saying she is a man in order to indicate that she is not a woman? That she is not a child? That she is human? See below...

Is she claiming to be a particular man? Yes If so, by name? Yes... Halloween relevant? ...Yes.
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Re: [Balin] Obnoxious

Postby android18 » Wed Jul 18, 2018 10:02 pm

Is she wearing a costume? If so, is it criticised? For not being scary? Not realistic? Is she actually insulted by them?
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Re: [Balin] Obnoxious

Postby Earnest » Fri Jul 20, 2018 6:43 am

Was she doing trick or treat and everybody ask her a treat? Nobody gave her sweets?
In agreeing with her, do adults fake something? E.g. fake to be scaried? Or for instance if she represented a ghost they fake not to see her? Or if she represented a vampire they fake to defend from her with garlic/holy water...? Was she upset from the way the adults recognize her as a man?

Relevant who she represent? Dracula? Freddie Krueger? Wolverine? A superhero? Someone scary?
Was Allie upset just in the moment in which adults recognize her as a man? Also after? Did she represent someone without arms? Legs? A zombie? A ghost?

To recap...before Halloween she planned to represent a man during Halloween night right? So she wanted to be recognized as a man by adults if I'm correct? To be sure can we assume that she was relevantly goibg from house to house making trick or treat? Was her at a party? Relevant? Did adults believe har after having seen her? Did she relevantly say to be that man after adults ask? Without adult asking her? Relevant? (I mean...if adult ask her/her mother something like:" who is this little pretty girl?", she knew already to have been discovered so that when she replied to be a man, she knew adults are cheatibg with her)

Did she represent someone who she thought was scary and evil but adults who watched the movie where this charachter was(read the book...e.g. some charachter that was represented as evil in movie and as a good person in the book.. )understood he was not evil and in faking to believe her were NOT scaried/made jokes? (E.g. Hulk...he is scary but not evil and he is part of the avengers)

P.s. just for the future..."to be masked" is different from "to wear a costume"?
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Re: [Balin] Obnoxious

Postby Balin » Sat Jul 21, 2018 7:04 pm

Is she wearing a costume? Yes If so, is it criticised? No For not being scary? No Not realistic? No Is she actually insulted by them? Not intentionally

Was she doing trick or treat and everybody ask her a treat? Nobody gave her sweets? No
In agreeing with her, do adults fake something? No E.g. fake to be scaried? Or for instance if she represented a ghost they fake not to see her? Or if she represented a vampire they fake to defend from her with garlic/holy water...? No to these Was she upset from the way the adults recognize her as a man? Yes

Relevant who she represent? You don't need to know the specific person to solve the puzzle, but... Dracula? Freddie Krueger? Wolverine? A superhero? Someone scary? ...No to all
Was Allie upset just in the moment in which adults recognize her as a man? Yes Also after? Given that I read about this years after, probably Did she represent someone without arms? Legs? A zombie? A ghost? No to all

To recap...before Halloween she planned to represent a man during Halloween night right? Yes So she wanted to be recognized as a man by adults if I'm correct? Yes To be sure can we assume that she was relevantly goibg from house to house making trick or treat? Yes Was her at a party? No Relevant? Not really Did adults believe har after having seen her? Yes Did she relevantly say to be that man after adults ask? No, but... Without adult asking her? ...Yes Relevant? Yes (I mean...if adult ask her/her mother something like:" who is this little pretty girl?", she knew already to have been discovered so that when she replied to be a man, she knew adults are cheatibg with her) Not this, but clever idea

Did she represent someone who she thought was scary and evil but adults who watched the movie where this charachter was(read the book...e.g. some charachter that was represented as evil in movie and as a good person in the book.. )understood he was not evil and in faking to believe her were NOT scaried/made jokes? (E.g. Hulk...he is scary but not evil and he is part of the avengers) No to all of this

P.s. just for the future..."to be masked" is different from "to wear a costume"? In general, yes - in this specific case, also yes, as Allie did not wear a mask as part of her costume
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Re: [Balin] Obnoxious

Postby GalFisk » Sun Jul 22, 2018 5:46 am

Did she say who she was immediately? As a response to something? Was she a character from real life? Fiction? Myth/legend/religion? Relevant?
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Re: [Balin] Obnoxious

Postby wolfier » Mon Jul 23, 2018 3:36 pm

Did the adults really recognise her as a man, or were they doing so jokingly? Did she notice?
Did she relevantly get a different quality / quantity of treats as a result of being "recognised" as a man?
Did she really believe that she became an adult after being recognised as a man? And then got upset for not being able to take part in kiddie activities, (e.g. trick-or-treat next year) because she's now a "grown-up"?
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Re: [Balin] Obnoxious

Postby Earnest » Mon Jul 23, 2018 6:21 pm

Had she been a little boy would she be upset as well? Did she relevantly have long hair? Did adult use the world "cute"? Or some other adjective/verbal construction meaning "pretty"/"cute"...? Female pronouns...?

Was she relevantly with a group of friends doing trick or treat? If so with little boys? With friends with which she paired in the costume? (E.g. she faked to be the head of someone...)
Was she relevantly without head? Is the immediate reaction of adults the one who matters? Or more the way they behave after the first reaction?

Did she represent a man transformed in some animal? Did all adults knew the man she represented? Did she said "I'm the man" with a scary voice expecting adults to be scared? Were adults faking to be scared by her? If so would she be upset had they simply said "oh Good how scary you are!!!"?

Did she relevantly knock the doors? Ring the bells?
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Re: [Balin] Obnoxious

Postby Balin » Tue Jul 24, 2018 1:36 pm

Did she say who she was immediately? No, good q As a response to something? Noish Was she a character from real life? Yes Fiction? Myth/legend/religion? Relevant? Maybe a little

Did the adults really recognise her as a man, or were they doing so jokingly? Jokingly, since it was Halloween Did she notice? Probably (but irrel)
Did she relevantly get a different quality / quantity of treats as a result of being "recognised" as a man? No
Did she really believe that she became an adult after being recognised as a man? And then got upset for not being able to take part in kiddie activities, (e.g. trick-or-treat next year) because she's now a "grown-up"? Clever idea, but this isn't it

Had she been a little boy would she be upset as well? Yes Did she relevantly have long hair? Yes (I'll add that this long hair was useful for the person she was dressed as) Did adult use the world "cute"? Or some other adjective/verbal construction meaning "pretty"/"cute"...? Female pronouns...? No/Irrel to these

Was she relevantly with a group of friends doing trick or treat? No (irrel) If so with little boys? With friends with which she paired in the costume? (E.g. she faked to be the head of someone...) Clever idea, but No
Was she relevantly without head? I like this! But no Is the immediate reaction of adults the one who matters? Yes Or more the way they behave after the first reaction?

Did she represent a man transformed in some animal? No Did all adults knew the man she represented? No, and that's the answer! Did she said "I'm the man" with a scary voice expecting adults to be scared? No Were adults faking to be scared by her? No If so would she be upset had they simply said "oh Good how scary you are!!!"? No

Did she relevantly knock the doors? Ring the bells? Irrel

****SPOILER****

Via Alexandra Petri:

"I went as John Adams for Halloween in 2nd or 3rd grade. My parents, knowing folks would not instantly see who I was, gently urged me to prepare a spiel, so I went door to door saying GOOD DAY I AM JOHN ADAMS I LET JEFFERSON WRITE THE DECLARATION. People still thought i was Mozart."
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Re: [Balin] Obnoxious (*SIT DOWN, JOHN*)

Postby Earnest » Tue Jul 24, 2018 2:05 pm

Nice one!
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Re: [Balin] Obnoxious (*SIT DOWN, JOHN*)

Postby wolfier » Tue Jul 24, 2018 2:07 pm

simple and nice!
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