[Balin] Floor fiasco

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[Balin] Floor fiasco

Postby Balin » Fri Jan 30, 2015 8:45 pm

At a certain public place, half the time I both enter and exit on the first floor, and the other half I enter on the second floor and exit on the first. What's going on?
I'm going to guess this will go quickly. I = me (Balin), and I use the American terms for floors (equivalent of British ground and first floor).
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Re: [Balin] Floor fiasco

Postby JenBurdoo » Sat Jan 31, 2015 4:54 am

I'm going to guess this is a shopping mall? On a slope, with parking lots on each side?
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Re: [Balin] Floor fiasco

Postby emeraldink » Sat Jan 31, 2015 9:46 am

Does moving inside this public place require special gear?
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Re: [Balin] Floor fiasco

Postby Balin » Sat Jan 31, 2015 12:45 pm

I'm going to guess this is a shopping mall? *sigh* Yes, but more specific. (When I said quick I didn't think that quick....) On a slope, with parking lots on each side? No

Does moving inside this public place require special gear? No
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Re: [Balin] Floor fiasco

Postby JenBurdoo » Sun Feb 01, 2015 1:17 am

I was right about the shopping mall? Awesome. Hm, so you do not enter and exit the shopping mall specifically? Perhaps you are entering and exiting a flagship store which has entrances on two floors?
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Re: [Balin] Floor fiasco

Postby Balin » Mon Feb 02, 2015 3:15 pm

I was right about the shopping mall? Awesome. Hm, so you do not enter and exit the shopping mall specifically? Perhaps you are entering and exiting a flagship store which has entrances on two floors? Assuming I know what you mean by "flagship store," Yes
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Re: [Balin] Floor fiasco

Postby Tiger » Mon Feb 02, 2015 3:37 pm

At the mall closest to me, you can enter through the "ground floor", and go into Urban Outfitters. If you go downstairs, there is another exit/entrance to the lower level of the mall.

Anything similar happening here?
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Re: [Balin] Floor fiasco

Postby Balin » Mon Feb 02, 2015 8:09 pm

At the mall closest to me, you can enter through the "ground floor", and go into Urban Outfitters. If you go downstairs, there is another exit/entrance to the lower level of the mall.
Anything similar happening here? Not exactly.
I'll clarify. I'm referring to one of the stores that serves as an entrance to the mall.
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Re: [Balin] Floor fiasco

Postby JenBurdoo » Tue Feb 03, 2015 6:16 pm

By flagship store I mean the big ones like JC Penney, Sears, Dillard's etc that are sort of the cornerstones of the mall and often the most obvious entrance, so that you have to pass through this large store in order to reach the mall proper through equally large inside entrances that may be on more than one floor. However, most malls also have other side entrances that can access the smaller stores without having to go through the big ones first, sometimes with restaurants outside or the food court immediately inside. Correct?

Are we discussing how you enter the mall, or just the store? Does the first-floor entrance through which you pass lead to the outside or inside of the mall? Do you work in this store, or in the mall? Or are you a frequent shopper? Meeting someone?
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Re: [Balin] Floor fiasco

Postby Balin » Wed Feb 04, 2015 4:35 pm

By flagship store I mean the big ones like JC Penney, Sears, Dillard's etc that are sort of the cornerstones of the mall and often the most obvious entrance, so that you have to pass through this large store in order to reach the mall proper through equally large inside entrances that may be on more than one floor. However, most malls also have other side entrances that can access the smaller stores without having to go through the big ones first, sometimes with restaurants outside or the food court immediately inside. Correct? Yes. In fact, it is a JC Penney.

Are we discussing how you enter the mall, or just the store? The store Does the first-floor entrance through which you pass lead to the outside or inside of the mall? ...Yes. Do you work in this store, or in the mall? No Or are you a frequent shopper? Not "frequent," but there is a store in the mall I go to on occasion. Meeting someone? No
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Re: [Balin] Floor fiasco

Postby JenBurdoo » Wed Feb 04, 2015 9:43 pm

Let me rephrase that: :D Does the first-floor entrance through which you pass lead to the outside of the mall? The inside?

Does the first-floor entrance through which you pass lead to the outside of the mall? The inside?

Do you exit through the same first-floor entrance every time? If so, is the first-floor entrance the same as the first-floor exit? If not, are you passing through different exits and entrances depending on whether you entered the first or second floor?
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Re: [Balin] Floor fiasco

Postby Balin » Tue Feb 10, 2015 4:35 pm

Let me rephrase that: :D Does the first-floor entrance through which you pass lead to the outside of the mall? The inside?

Does the first-floor entrance through which you pass lead to the outside of the mall? The inside?

Do you exit through the same first-floor entrance every time? If so, is the first-floor entrance the same as the first-floor exit? If not, are you passing through different exits and entrances depending on whether you entered the first or second floor? Here we go. The first-floor entrance leads to the outside; the second-floor entrance, to the inside. One of the first-floor exits leads to the outside, the other to the inside.
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Re: [Balin] Floor fiasco

Postby JenBurdoo » Wed Feb 11, 2015 2:42 pm

So, half the time you enter and exit the JC Penney through its first-floor entrance/exit?

And the other half you enter the JC Penney from the rest of the mall (the second-floor entrance)? And exit the JC Penney through the first-floor entrance/exit? Exiting JC Penney to the outside? Or inside?

Does this have anything to do with where you parked when you arrived at the mall, or from which direction you came to arrive there? Your purpose for visiting the mall?
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Re: [Balin] Floor fiasco

Postby Balin » Wed Feb 11, 2015 8:00 pm

So, half the time you enter and exit the JC Penney through its first-floor entrance/exit? Yope. Beware FA.

And the other half you enter the JC Penney from the rest of the mall (the second-floor entrance)? Same as above And exit the JC Penney through the first-floor entrance/exit? Yes Exiting JC Penney to the outside? This, when I enter from the second floor Or inside?

Does this have anything to do with where you parked when you arrived at the mall, or from which direction you came to arrive there? Yes - the parking lot is outside the 1st floor of the JC Penney Your purpose for visiting the mall? Yes

To help clear the potential FA, I should mention that my purpose is to go to another store in the mall.
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Re: [Balin] Floor fiasco

Postby irishelk » Sun Feb 15, 2015 2:53 pm

When you enter and exit both on the first floor, that's when you're going into the mall, and when you enter from the second floor and exit from the first, that's when you're leaving the mall? Something like that? Because the store you actually want to go to is on the second floor, but you have to come from the parking lot into the JCPenney through the first floor?

If all that is correct, is there a relevant reason you can't go to the second floor while still inside the JCPenney? Maybe the escalator's broken? Or you're avoiding the perfume counter? =)
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Re: [Balin] Floor fiasco

Postby Balin » Sun Feb 15, 2015 3:14 pm

When you enter and exit both on the first floor, that's when you're going into the mall, and when you enter from the second floor and exit from the first, that's when you're leaving the mall? Something like that? Yes.

Because the store you actually want to go to is on the second floor, but you have to come from the parking lot into the JCPenney through the first floor? Also correct.

If all that is correct, is there a relevant reason you can't go to the second floor while still inside the JCPenney? There is not a reason I can't do that, but there is one why I don't. Maybe the escalator's broken? Or you're avoiding the perfume counter? =) Neither
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Re: [Balin] Floor fiasco

Postby irishelk » Sun Feb 15, 2015 11:41 pm

Are you visiting two stores? And one is on the first floor inside the mall? Is there something else you do on the first floor of the mall? On the first floor of JCPenneys? Is another person involved?

Is it relevant how you get from second to first floor when you are leaving? If so, elevator? Escalator? Stairs?

Should we find out what kind of store you are visiting?
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Re: [Balin] Floor fiasco

Postby Balin » Mon Feb 16, 2015 3:50 am

Are you visiting two stores? No, just one And one is on the first floor inside the mall?
Is there something else you do on the first floor of the mall? Technically Yes by the letter of the question. By the spirit of the question, No On the first floor of JCPenneys? No Is another person involved? No

Is it relevant how you get from second to first floor when you are leaving? Yes If so, elevator? Escalator? This Stairs?

Should we find out what kind of store you are visiting? No
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Re: [Balin] Floor fiasco

Postby emeraldink » Thu Feb 19, 2015 8:51 am

Stair climbing relevant?

If not by stairs, how are you getting from the first floor of the mall to the second, where the store in question is located?
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Re: [Balin] Floor fiasco

Postby Balin » Thu Feb 19, 2015 4:23 pm

Stair climbing relevant? No, only escalators

If not by stairs, how are you getting from the first floor of the mall to the second, where the store in question is located? Escalator
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Re: [Balin] Floor fiasco

Postby emeraldink » Fri Feb 20, 2015 1:15 am

Are up and down escalators in the mall located far apart?

Is your reason for taking this particular route to and from your destination store:
shortest distance?
shortest time?
scenery?
information you need to see before going up?
socializing with someone?
one of the escalators being out of order or unsafe, in your opinion?
bad memories of the alternative route?
habit?
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Re: [Balin] Floor fiasco

Postby Balin » Fri Feb 20, 2015 3:31 pm

Are up and down escalators in the mall located far apart? No

Is your reason for taking this particular route to and from your destination store:
shortest distance? This
shortest time?
scenery?
information you need to see before going up?
socializing with someone?
one of the escalators being out of order or unsafe, in your opinion?
bad memories of the alternative route?
habit?
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Re: [Balin] Floor fiasco

Postby emeraldink » Sat Feb 21, 2015 10:38 pm

Are up and down escalators in J. C. Penny located far apart?

Are floor plans for both floors identical?

Are there obstacls or construction zones? Shortcuts?
One-way pedestrian traffic?
Are there special events on the second floor at the time you come in, but not when you leave?
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Re: [Balin] Floor fiasco

Postby Balin » Sat Feb 21, 2015 11:09 pm

Are up and down escalators in J. C. Penny located far apart? No, but...

Are floor plans for both floors identical? Irrel, assume Yes

Are there obstacles or construction zones? Shortcuts? One-way pedestrian traffic? Are there special events on the second floor at the time you come in, but not when you leave? No to all
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Re: [Balin] Floor fiasco

Postby emeraldink » Sun Feb 22, 2015 2:22 am

Are up and down escalators in J. C. Penny different? in such a way that one is shorter or slower then the other?
Is it relevant where these and mall escalators start and stop relative to the store you are visiting?
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Re: [Balin] Floor fiasco

Postby irishelk » Sun Feb 22, 2015 2:36 pm

Is the escalator inside the mall situated so that it is in a direct line from the first-floor door to your second-floor shop? Whereas you would have to venture further into the JC Penney's to use their escalator?
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Re: [Balin] Floor fiasco

Postby Balin » Sun Feb 22, 2015 7:07 pm

Are up and down escalators in J. C. Penny different? in such a way that one is shorter or slower then the other? No, not like this
Is it relevant where these and mall escalators start and stop relative to the store you are visiting? Yope, OTRT

Is the escalator inside the mall situated so that it is in a direct line from the first-floor door to your second-floor shop? The UP escalator, Yes Whereas you would have to venture further into the JC Penney's to use their escalator? No
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Re: [Balin] Floor fiasco

Postby GalFisk » Tue Feb 24, 2015 1:54 pm

Is there no down escalator near the up escalator? Is the down escalator in another store? In the common area? Nowhere to be seen? Do you go a different way to avoid: escalators? Stairs? To use escalators? Stairs? Any elevators relevant? Going the wrong way in an escalator involved? Do the relevant escalators always work within the context of the puzzle? Or do you walk a different way when an escalator doesn't work?
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Re: [Balin] Floor fiasco

Postby Balin » Tue Feb 24, 2015 2:13 pm

Is there no down escalator near the up escalator? No, there is one
Is the down escalator in another store? In the common area? There's more than one down escalator in the mall. I use the DOWN escalator in the J. C. Penney, but not the UP. Nowhere to be seen?
Do you go a different way to avoid: escalators? Stairs? To use escalators? This Stairs?
Any elevators relevant? No Going the wrong way in an escalator involved? Like up a down escalator? No
Do the relevant escalators always work within the context of the puzzle? Yes Or do you walk a different way when an escalator doesn't work?
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Re: [Balin] Floor fiasco

Postby GalFisk » Thu Feb 26, 2015 12:02 pm

When you use the JC Down, do you use any up escalator anywhere at all? Or any up stairs? Or path? Or do you leave the mall lower than you started? Do you not want to enter JC after you have bought stuff somewhere else? In order not to be suspected as a thief? Or avoid some other hassle?
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Re: [Balin] Floor fiasco

Postby Balin » Thu Feb 26, 2015 12:31 pm

When you use the JC Down, do you use any up escalator anywhere at all? Well, the store I go to is on the second floor of the mall, so I only use an up escalator going to the store. Using the JC Down, I am leaving the mall. Or any up stairs? Or path? Or do you leave the mall lower than you started? No
Do you not want to enter JC after you have bought stuff somewhere else? In order not to be suspected as a thief? Or avoid some other hassle? Nothing like this
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Re: [Balin] Floor fiasco

Postby Balin » Thu Feb 26, 2015 12:32 pm

And the up escalator I use when going to the store is not the one in JC Penney, but one of the up escalators in the main mall.
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Re: [Balin] Floor fiasco

Postby GalFisk » Thu Feb 26, 2015 1:46 pm

Is the up escalator you use: more conveniently placed? Less crowded? Does going that way let you pass something relevant? Or avoid passing something relevant?
Same questions for the down escalator.
Or are you like me, and enjoy walking a different way back from wherever you've been, just for the change of scenery?
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Re: [Balin] Floor fiasco

Postby Balin » Fri Feb 27, 2015 3:54 am

Is the up escalator you use: more conveniently placed? This, No to rest Less crowded? Does going that way let you pass something relevant? Or avoid passing something relevant?
Same questions for the down escalator. Same answers
Or are you like me, and enjoy walking a different way back from wherever you've been, just for the change of scenery? While I do find that pleasant on occasion, this is not what I'm doing here.
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Re: [Balin] Floor fiasco

Postby GalFisk » Fri Feb 27, 2015 8:43 am

Is it relevant that you buy things? Carry them? Or would it be convenient even if you ended up not buying anything? Does convenient equal shortest? Both locations ahe one up and one down escalator, correct? If so, are they parallel? Crisscrossing? Set at a right angle to each other? Some other relevant angle? If you had gone the opposite way, would the escalators carry you up in the opposite direction from where you were going? So you'd have to turn and walk some extra distance?
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Re: [Balin] Floor fiasco

Postby Balin » Fri Feb 27, 2015 2:23 pm

Is it relevant that you buy things? Carry them? Or would it be convenient even if you ended up not buying anything? Yes Does convenient equal shortest? Yes Both locations are one up and one down escalator, correct? Yes If so, are they parallel? One of them is this Crisscrossing? The other one is this Set at a right angle to each other? Some other relevant angle?

If you had gone the opposite way, would the escalators carry you up in the opposite direction from where you were going? So you'd have to turn and walk some extra distance? This is pretty much it.

****SPOILER****

There's one mall I go to every so often when I need to go to a particular store. This store is on the second floor, on the other side of the mall from the J.C. Penney where I enter (on the first floor). When I'm going to the store, I don't use the J.C. Penney up escalator because it criss-crosses with the down escalator; I'd have to turn around, go up the escalator (backtracking on my path), then turn around and go through the mall. Instead, I use one of the up escalators in the mall, as it's on a more direct line to the actual store. When I'm leaving, I do use the down escalator in the J.C. Penney because it takes me on a straight path to the exit.

This turned out a little bit trickier than I thought. Nice job working through it.
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